Major flourescent problem

[Couleddie]

Been to have a look at a local call centre where the flourescent fittings are playing up. Place was totally refurbished 3 years ago. Around 100 recessed 4x18w T8 HF fittings with 2 ballasts per fitting. At a rough count I found 200 tubes unlit which would account for 25 percent of the entire installation. Almost all the failures are either 2 or 4 tubes which would indicate ballast failure.

What is puzzling me is why so many of these fittings are failing after only 3 years in service. The fittings are manufactured by Contrac Lighting (which is not far from me).

Anybody got any clue as to what is going on here as the manager is having kittens about the place gradually descending into darkness. I obviously don't want to start replacing the ballasts and then find some other issue is causing them to fail. But I can't think of what these issues (if any) could be. Am I missing something obvious?

 

[Andy™]

failed lamps being left for months before being replaced?

and if a HF ballast feeds 2 tubes, a failure of 1 will usually stop the other working

 

[Couleddie]

[quote name='Andy

 

[Evans Electric]

Can't be much else then lf they are aware of the one failed tube thing, theres nothing else in the circuit other than dodgey lampholders , which I would doubt .

Only other thing is if there are any switchstart fittings on the same circuit. Can cause problems.

I'm not much of a fan of HF lighting TBH , as I posted some time ago , we supplied and fitted a load of 6ft twins at a printers over the main press then another line ,different make , over the binding & finishing .

After a year the HF gear started to carp out on both makes of fitting but same gear . ( Tridonic)

 

[septiclecky]

If a lamp fails on a HF ballast they are designed to switch themselves off so they do not keep flashing on and off.

Try replacing the tubes making sure you switch the supply off to them so they reset themselves

 

[Riggy]

If a lamp fails on a HF ballast they are designed to switch themselves off so they do not keep flashing on and off. Try replacing the tubes making sure you switch the supply off to them so they reset themselves

Your second paragraph is spot on, the first one I'm not so sure about. I believe Tridonic HF ballast are designed to be a pile of poo. If not, they consistently achieve it by accident!

I'm fed up of explaining to customers the benefits (i.e. increased cost!) of HF, only for the Tridonic ballasts to fail within two years. I can look a fool on my own without their help!

 

[revjames]

we use 100's of HF fittings and always replace ballasts with Tridonic. In face we insist on them. Newlec ones get sent back. Not had any issues.

 

[wozz]

how often are they switched on and off? left on 24/7?

 

[Rossmc]

Yeah if they are hf the supply will need to be removed for a good 10 seconds

 

[Couleddie]

how often are they switched on and off? left on 24/7?

I'm guessing it's a 24 hour operation.

Have had some of the fittings de-energised, swapped tubes etc, but no effect.

 

[wozz]

Thats over 26k hours, how long are the ballasts supposed to last from manuf instructions?

To be honest mate replacing ballasts is easy money and frequent work, wish tridonic had made some sort of plug system though!

 

[Couleddie]

Thats over 26k hours, how long are the ballasts supposed to last from manuf instructions? To be honest mate replacing ballasts is easy money and frequent work, wish tridonic had made some sort of plug system though!

No idea what the average lifespan is but I guess they've exceeded it from the amount that have gone.

Don't look too difficult to replace. 15 mins per fitting tops?. Would you charge per unit or by time?

 

[SLIPSHOD & SLAPDASH]

I was beaten to it. If they are on 24/7 electronic ballasts dont seem to last, or as said there 'normal' life is up. Also the heat from fittings on 24/7 destroys all the plastics and they disintegrate when you touch anything.

 

[batty]

Well I think thats the reason it would be like driving a car none stop for two years something would have to give. people moan about Tridonic ballasts but as they seem to be the main manufacturer surely you will have more going than any other brands.

 

[steptoe]

Well I think thats the reason it would be like driving a car none stop for two years something would have to give. people moan about Tridonic ballasts but as they seem to be the main manufacturer surely you will have more going than any other brands.

bit like saying (as an example)

10% of breakdowns are ford,

OK,

but in fact 80% of cars are ford,

that actually makes them 8% fail rate,

so 20% of the others are making up for 90% of failures.

 

[batty]

You are getting too technical for this time of the morning.

 

[Couleddie]

Thanks as always for the info/opinions as well as the usual entertainment value thrown in for free.

Will be breaking the bad news to the customer today. hopefully it will be an ongoing thing as the rest of them gradually pop off.

 

[PC Electrics]

What is puzzling me is why so many of these fittings are failing after only 3 years in service. The fittings are manufactured by Contrac Lighting (which is not far from me).

There's a number of further questions and some very good points raised in the various posts here. Have you thought about contacting the manufacturer and asking for one of their technical guys to come and investigate and advise. Maybe he could answer some of the questions raised (esp about expected life and the effect of 24/7 operation).

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And in return, if they say that lifetime is limited you could suggest to them that they look into the "design for service" aspect of their fittings.

 

[Couleddie]

I've since spoken again to the customer and the place is NOT 24 hours so we're looking at less usage. I would be seriously irritated if, after 3 years, half of my fittings started going pop. Surely these fittings are designed to run for, let's say, 10 hours a day and that a reasonable lifespan can be expected. 3 years is not what I would call reasonable. The customer's concern is that they'll be forking out another shed load of money in another 3 years when they need replacing again as well as the ongoing issue with the rest of the original fittings going tits up.

Have contacted the manufacturer to see if they have anything to say.

Still, the bottom line is that it's a nice bit of work.

 

[Evans Electric]

The fittings we installed were , 1st Fitzgerald then Crompton .

I contacted Fitzgerald but couldn't get a comment from them regarding Tridonic.

We then had a job to move another printer into new premises and went with Dextra Lighting and against advice we installed standard Switchstart 5ft twin fittings and only ever changed a few starters .