Question about our two favourite subjects - beer and electricity :)

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kme

kme

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Evenin` all

So - I need a beer transfer pump for a brewery - used for shifting the mix, at varying stages, between the mash tun, copper, and fermenting vessels - and for "racking up" into the barrels

They`ve already got one - a TP, 3KW motor on a VFD ( Lowara CEAM 70/3 304 stainless) - I think 3KW is a bit over-engineered, TBH - max lift height is 2.2metres, into the fermentation vessels.

I believe the kit is a "lowara" pump, with 110 deg. C food grade seals on the pump itself.

We`re going to need one (or two) more pumps - with VFDs to suit...........

I`ve done the standard searches - wondered if anyone knew of any good suppliers (been quoted almost

 
For the past 40 years I have assisted all the major breweries in transfering Ale from the Pub to the sewage system along with providing a filtering /absorption system in the process. Alas, no more, as I am now presently assisting the Grape growers on the same project. I am sorry to be as much use as a GB entrant in a Eurovision Contest.............. :Y

 
Evenin` allSo - I need a beer transfer pump...

Thanks guys
Click to expand...
Is this to get the Guinness from your fridge to your glass? :D

Surely you're not grtting lazy in your latter years?

:innocent ;)

 
Dave:

28mm bore - predominantly flexible.

Always pos. head - max lift is approx 2.2M; to top of vessels - although, if they use their existing one for that, then it would only be for filling barrels.

The rigid pipework is also approx 28mm, with 4 bends and a heat exchanger; but I don`t believe the new units would be required to route through that - I envisage it primarily being used for transfer from vessels to barrels..........

Flow rate.......I dunno mate. I`ll try to get an idea on Weds. As said, they`re currently using the lowara, but I don`t know the flow rate from that - the other will probably want approx the same.

 
Solid pipework is stainless - the flexi is a type of reinforced PVC.

Sketch? How about a piccie? ( me & sketches aren`t all that good - maybe i can get Mrs. to do one (when she actually sees it!)

 
You'll also need to allow for flushing rates, as these are more often than not higher than process rates.

Also depending on what you are transferring, it may be a non-Newtonian fluid thus the fluid properties will not be the same as water, and may vary with temperature & shear stresses, as per the pump, this could be why it seems the existing pump is over sized?

I believe that in the early stages of brewing the "stuff" is non-Newtonian, and has significant viscosity, density and shear strength, it's been a few years since I worked in the brewery mind!

 
Sorry KME this is one area (amongst others)that I can offer no help at all.

 
OK:

Update is as follows:

one pump is for stored water pumping - they`re having 3000 litres of water in IPS containers, which will need to be pumped.

In both cases, min flow rates of 2000 litres per hour.

The beer pump need to have a varispeed drive - doesn`t matter if its single or three phase.

They`ve currently been quoted about

 
So you are only pumping water & beer, nothing else?

In which case treat both as water.

They will need to be able to withstand the cleaning chemicals which are quite harsh, & of washdown food duty, thus IP65 as a minimum and stainless steel.

What pipework is existing, what sizes materials etc. as Canoe asked.

 
Existing pipework as described previously; 28mm stainless and 28mm flexi reinforced PVC hose. Stainless steel fittings.

The beer pump will have to withstand the cleaning chemicals; the water one won`t - that just needs to be capable of boosting the water pressure from the stored vessels; I`d envisaged a flow switch ( positive head will exist), for the hose pipes and jetwasher supplies.

Photos on `phone - I`ll get em up shortly.

 
Both pumps will still have to have food grade pumping units as the water will be part of the beer making process, thus part of a "food" making process, thus, it will need to be inert, i.e. not be able to contaminate the water supply in any way, i.e. almost certainly stainless steel.

What sort of stainless, is it longitudinally seamed or seamless?

Are the joints flanged or screwed?

Is the spiral wound hose smooth bore?

 
The water for the washing, which will come from the stored units, is NOT involved in the beer making - its just a standard pump, from the info. I`ve been provided.

If the stainless has a seam, I haven`t noticed it.

The joints are belled and screwed.

The hose is diamond, not spiral; and has a smooth bore.

:)

 
OK if the water is not for the beer making then any old water pump will do, it won't have any stainless pipework involved then surely?

The joints are like compression joints but with a flare onto the end of a coned male fitting then?

The seam would be hard to see to be honest, but it will make a difference to streamlining the pressure and flow calcs as seamless & longitudinally seamed tubes have a different pressure loss co-efficient.

Similar to these?

http://www.parker.com/portal/site/PARKER/menuitem.7100150cebe5bbc2d6806710237ad1ca?vgnextdiv=687620&vgnextfmt=default&vgnextcatid=12704&vgnextcat=TRIPLE-LOK%2037%20DEGREE%20FLARE%20-%20STAINLESS%20STEEL%20(SS)&vgnextoid=f5c9b5bbec622110VgnVCM10000032a71dacRCRD

The hose is then internally reinforced like this?

Megaflex - Clear Reinforced PVC Hose

I can get both these types of bits from my usual suppliers locally.

 
Hose - looks right.

S.S fittings - not quite - see pics below.

The first one is the rigid SS pipework; with the flanges and nuts visible on the ends.

IMG00016.jpg


The second shows the heat xchanger, and the 1" flexi hose hanging up beside it.

IMG00017.jpg


Does that help?

---------- Post Auto-Merged at 15:49 ---------- Previous post was made at 15:45 ----------

p.s. They had a brewery specialist come in to do the original wiring which can be seen behind..............

That would be why the door to the VFD cabinet only opens 5" before it hits the rigid pipework in front of it. :slap

Think it might get redone before long.........the 18KW TP heater can only be run overnight - they`ve subbed the brewery from the pub; and we didn`t have much spare capacity in there before...............

So they can only load onto the pub when its shut :slap

WPD pole directly across the road - BUT the TX up there is apparently at capacity on one phase; so they`ll have to upgrade it before they can either give us a second supply, or upgrade the existing (which will have to be done next year anyway!!!!!!!!)

 
Get them to upgrade now, rather than next year!

Prices will go up by then.

This could be contestable works anyway.

Get them to put a dedicated supply into the brewery.

I can't remember, is this the same job we were discussing the boards for?

What are you trying to achieve again?

Just a booster pump to feed the pressure washer, from IBC's is one pump yes?

The second is a backup or duplicate for the existing process pump?

 

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