Quick question - commercial electics.

[ProDave]

Just got a job to do to rewire part of a garage. That's a motor vehicle repair garage not a domestic garage.

It will all be surface in trunking and conduit.

So am I right that even under 17th I don't need RCD's on everything?

 

[revjames]

No - socket outlets that could be used by an untrained person for example in a waiting room might need them but not anywhere else. Not a bad idea to fit them if customer will pay tho....

 

[septiclecky]

Good idea to fit them as if there are any trailing lead light cables etc.

 

[ProDave]

No - socket outlets that could be used by an untrained person for example in a waiting room might need them but not anywhere else. Not a bad idea to fit them if customer will pay tho....

I'm thinking of just lighting on Non RCD side and ALL sockets and machines RCD protected.

Although part of a garage, it's just a mezzanine floor that will be an office and a storage platform, plus new sockets downstairs in what will remain a small workshop with the "machines" (tyre fitting and balancing machine, pillar drill etc)

 

[NozSpark]

You might be better off having the socket circuit in the workshop on the Non-RCD side and then using RCD sockets, all sockets in other areas could be on RCBO protected circuits!

 

[Evans Electric]

I'd go for RCD protected sockets in the workshop although its not a requirement, would'nt bother with the office part.

Deke

 

[sparkytim]

Are the Garage employees Electrically skilled or instructed?

are all sockets for specific designated equipment use only?

If not then RCD PROTECTION IS REQUIRED

See OSG Pg 55 7.2.5

BRB pG 47 411.3.3

 

[Andy™]

instructed could simply be telling staff 'sockets are non-RCD'd'

 

[ProDave]

My intention was to RCD protect all sockets and fixed machinery. It's just the lights, wired on the surface in trunking, conduit, or possible in some parts clipped direct T&E that won't be.

As far as I can tell they don't need RCD protection.

 

[Andy™]

you may not even need to RCD the fixed machinery, but may be a good idea if its really old or abused

 

[sparkytim]

[quote name='Andy

 

[ProDave]

I would think it's fair to say anybody working in a garage must be at very least an instructed person.

 

[sparkytim]

I would think it's fair to say anybody working in a garage must be at very least an instructed person.

Have You seen the Electrical lash ups in a Commercial Garage?

They may be skilled in Auto electrics but in my experiance know very little about safe electrical installation

Like many a little knowledge is a dangerous thing

 

[Andy™]

Have You seen the Electrical lash ups in a Commercial Garage?They may be skilled in Auto electrics but in my experiance know very little about safe electrical installation

Like many a little knowledge is a dangerous thing

and have you seen the many garages where everything is safe? we dont know much about existing installation or the competency of the staff

 

[batty]

I would RCD protect sockets because if anything goes wrong you will be to blame. Garages are dangerous places and you do not know who is going to be employed there. Other things will not need RCD protection as long as its surface.

 

[spinlondon]

I believe that socket-outlets that are for mobile equipment to be used outdoors have to be RCD protected, irrespective of whether they are being used by instructed/skilled persons. Reg. 4111.3.3.

 

[binky]

A business like a garage should have its own risk assessment and implement staff training iaw Health and Safety at Work guidelines - ergo risk to staff is responsibility of owners including safe use of equipment and associated electrical items. I would discuss this with owners and suggest RCDs/RCBOs to improve safety, reduce law suits, lost working time. But also check equipment if powerred down does not pose a threat eg lifting gear/ramps, in which case RCDs are very bad :^O

Only portable electrical gear I've ever noticed in a garage is work lamps and pressure washers, everything else is usually air powered. So would be inclined to insist on PAT regime for portable electrical items, and RCD socket for outdoor useage of washer. Put recommendations in writing, keep a safe copy, and get on with important job. ut the kettle on

 

[spinlondon]

Welders, polishing mops, battery chargers and even hoovers are often used outside.

 

[ProDave]

I first fixed this last week.

There wasn't much wiring in the building before, just two double 13A sockets, one 8ft flourescent light and a single 3 phase circuit that used to feed a hoist (SWA left cut off and hanging from ceiling)

One of the 13A sockets was fed in 1mm t&e from the light circuit !!!

I've done as planned everything except lighting on RCD side.

 

[mikep]

It sounds like a garden garage after all, being so small, for what the costs are I would Rcd it except the lighting, and if anything like a compressor that's fixed then that I would just hard wire it in with no Rcd,

Mike.