RCD tripping

[bulmer]

As the man in the orthorpedic shoes said, I stand corrected! :coat

Thats a good one never heard that one before.

I shouldn't be so harsh, its christmas after all, I apologise.

 

[tom1]

well, i didn t move anything,just i replaced the old rcd.How can those lights were working yesterday and today are faulty?

what i am thinking to try is to borrow a neutral from another working light , to see if is working?It s this ok?

dont think i quite get whats going on.

everything worked

u changed 2 switch

everything worked

next day turning bathroom lights on trips rcd but the light circuit is still live.

 

[loonytoon]

I shouldn't be so harsh, its christmas after all, I apologise.

Accepted, have a few of these on me. Guinness Guinness

 

[SoulkillaH]

dont think i quite get whats going on.everything worked

u changed 2 switch

everything worked

next day turning bathroom lights on trips rcd but the light circuit is still live.

the 2 switches were faulty.

I changed them and everything looks fine.(i didn t check the bathroom lights)

Today the guy called and told me the sockets are not working.

changed the rcd.new one still tripped cause the switch of the lights was on.

even if the rcd is tripping, i have live on the bathroom lights.(just live, lights are not working)

That s why i am thinking is a problem with the neutral. Can i run another neutral from a working light? Is this allowed?

 

[SoulkillaH]

Accepted, have a few of these on me. Guinness Guinness

Guys, i have a problem here!!!!headbangheadbangheadbang

PrayPray



Btw , yesterday a part of Guinness factory here in Dublin was on fire from a torch used by a drunk worker! ROTFWL

 

[loonytoon]

:coat

 

[SoulkillaH]

the 2 switches were faulty.I changed them and everything looks fine.(i didn t check the bathroom lights)

Today the guy called and told me the sockets are not working.

changed the rcd.new one still tripped cause the switch of the lights was on.

even if the rcd is tripping, i have live on the bathroom lights.(just live, lights are not working)

That s why i am thinking is a problem with the neutral. Can i run another neutral from a working light? Is this allowed?

any thoughts?

 

[loonytoon]

Is it a split load board? Does the RCD acually control lights? Are the Tails round the right way?

 

[SoulkillaH]

Is it a split load board? Does the RCD acually control lights? Are the Tails round the right way?

no, the rcd doesn t control the lights.

yes, the tails are in the right way.

is a split load board

 

[paul b b]

does it trip when you put any lamp in any holder? i had 1 the other day that triped the rcd because the filiment was dangling and touching the metal casing

 

[tom1]

have u put a test lamp across the live and neutral at the first light fiting?

what tester did u use to test that it was live

if the rcd trips and u lose the neutral but keep the live then it looks like the neutral is borrrowed, what does not make sence is that its only just started to trip. u say there is no earth connection, are they class II lights then but even so there should be a earth terminal unless they are slev

 

[loonytoon]

I think you have a borrowed neutral, however, why has it only just started happening, when all you did was change two switches the day before?

Is any other building work going on? Is it possible someone has put a nail somewhere? Putting christmas decs up?

 

[SoulkillaH]

I think you have a borrowed neutral, however, why has it only just started happening, when all you did was change two switches the day before?Is any other building work going on? Is it possible someone has put a nail somewhere? Putting christmas decs up?

Everything else is working fine not the bathroom lights.

I am thinking to a borrowed neutral from sockets as well.

I ll check for x mas lights as well tomorrow.

I am not quite sure if it starts exactly after i changed the switches.

All i know, the rcd is protecting the sockets circuits.

the bathroom lights are protected by a mcb

when the mcb is on and i switch the bathroom lights on, the rcd is tripping not the mcb.after that ,the light circuit is still live not the socket circuit.

I have a very very weak feeling, the guy from that flat did something somewhere, because few weeks ago he asked me to replace a bathroom heater and he told me he tried to repair it.But is just a feeling not sure 100%.

If so,what should i check first?

 

[loonytoon]

I have a very very weak feeling, the guy from that flat did something somewhere, because few weeks ago he asked me to replace a bathroom heater and he told me he tried to repair it.But is just a feeling not sure 100%.If so,what should i check first?

Ah ha! This may be your problem.

You may find that the bathroom heater is running of the sockets, and he's maybe borrowed a neutral from the lights to try and get it working.

You may also find that the heater is running off the lighting circuit, which is quite common, and he has borrowed a neutral from the sockets.

House or bungalow?

 

[SoulkillaH]

Is a 2 bedrooms flat.

i don t think he did this kind of work.

The bathroom heater is working fine.I ll check it again tomorrow to see if is not connected somehow with the lights.

hopefully tomorrow i will manage to find the fault.

I ll ask once again- can i connect neutrall from the another working light to see if is the bathroom lights are working with another neutral?

 

[tom1]

i could see taking the neutral from 1 of the lights as the live would be switch live, but if u take the live from the socket its easier to take the neutral as well

 

[SoulkillaH]

i could see taking the neutral from 1 of the lights as the live would be switch live, but if u take the live from the socket its easier to take the neutral as well

i don t have live from a socket.

so,it s ok trying to feed the neutral from another light which is working?

 

[tom1]

sorry mate i was replying to loonytoon post.

taking from els were quickly to see if it works, some one with more experiance can answer that i aint going to advise it.

and if it does work its not a perminent fix, if u was going to do that u may as well take the L N and E from the other lights asuming they are on a diff breaker.

something is missing here, if it was a N E fault on the light fitting then the rcd would trip but the cable would be dead, if the neutral was rcd side and live non rcd than it would trip the first time the lights were turned on.

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

Is a 2 bedrooms flat.i don t think he did this kind of work.

The bathroom heater is working fine.I ll check it again tomorrow to see if is not connected somehow with the lights.

hopefully tomorrow i will manage to find the fault.

I ll ask once again- can i connect neutrall from the another working light to see if is the bathroom lights are working with another neutral?

If the light is from another circuit then NO! as it would not comply with Reg 314.4 page 39 of BS7671!.

If the light is from the same circuit.. yes you could... but IMHO if the fault is on the "circuit" just taking the neutral from another point on the same 'faulty' circuit neutral.. will make very little difference to your symptoms!?

If the original circuit was wired incorrectly, (e.g. borrowed neutrals as already mentioned by others), then need to trace & rectify the problem.. not just pick a random light to guess at getting it working.

That said.. if you think you do have a faulty circuit I would be going back to Dead tests, Not random live tests.

General observations...

I have read down the thread, (apologies if i have missed it but), I have NOT seen any mention of any meter readings or tests carried out?

Which is IMHO the first things that should have been done..

1/ You said you changed the RCD, why?

was it proved faulty...?

i.e. what were your results for the trip tests when following the guidance in chapter 11 on site guide, page 91 onward,

(paragraph 11.1 test as near to RCD as possible with all loads disconnected).

What are the trip times you got for the original & replacement RCD's

2/ If you have proved the RCD was within spec, what are your test readings for the "suspect light circuit"

e.g. Disconnect ALL conductors for the circuit from CU,

I would then start with a 250v insulation resistance tests..

L-E

N-E

L-N

Also I would test each circuit conductor L,N & E

back to the N and E bars of the CU in turn.

a good circuit with all conductors disconnected should be completely open circuit back the the CU, no electrical path, high resistance!

Any low readings would point you toward the cables/conductors you need to start investigating.

HTH

:|

 

[tom1]

now thats an answer worth staying up for,

are u on another late one then spec.

it all seems a bit dodgy to me how its just started to trip, and still being live.

the tennent has prob changed something. or it was dodgy befor and they call u in to change a switch and then claim the lights dont work since u were there.

is this your property, if not do u do a lot of work for the owner