Supplementary bonding question

[andy8758]

Need some help to solve an argument. Many electric showers specify in their instructions that "supplemenatry bonding must be installed." If the existing system has the circuit protected by and RCD I believe that no supplemenatry bonding is required (as per regs). A colleague reckons that because the regs also require you to comply with the manufacturers installation requirements, then you must still fit supplementary bonding.

Anyone able to solve the argument for me?

 

[Barx]

Yer, stop reading the manuals. Causes tooooo much headache.

 

[a1]

You're both right. ; \

 

[green-hornet]

I have had similar arguments.

The problem we find ourselves in now are

a, no supplementary bonding required if the following conditions are met

blah, blah, blah

b, manufacturers warranties are deemed void if:- a, they are not installed as per manufacturers instructions, blah blah blah.

Problem is most of these showers where made and packaged before the 17th came into force, and they will not recall a product to change the installation instructions.

One thing they never say is "do not supplementary bond if pipe work is all plastic".

There is a clause in the wording regarding all manufacturers instructions,"in accordance with BS 7671 2008."

So to argue your corner I would say you are right and the manufacturer is mistaken in the instructions they give.

 

[Andy™]

dont read the manual and your sorted

 

[Apache]

dont read the manual and your sorted

Well, of course Andy - ignorance is always a perfect exhuse in court

 

[The Godfather]

Well, of course Andy - ignorance is always a perfect exhuse in court

Sadly, not a reasonable excuse (in many circumstances).

Don

 

[Apache]

Sadly, not a reasonable excuse (in many circumstances).Don

That was the point I was making

 

[The Godfather]

That was the point I was making

Just for you:



Don

 

[Apache]

Just for you:

Don

Thankyou sir

 

[The Godfather]

The Don is in a good mood.

The Godfather

 

[Apache]

The Don is in a good mood.The Godfather

credit crunch, people are getting rid of their horses, leading to over supply and falling prices?

 

[The Godfather]

credit crunch, people are getting rid of their horses, leading to over supply and falling prices?

The Godfather

 

[Andy™]

Instructions normally get read after it doesnt work and a minimum of 4 hours has been wasted trying to get it to work.... then read manual and get it working in 5 mins...

 

[Aeromarc]

I would always fit the sup bonding as you dont always know the condition of other circuit wiring adjacent to pipework for your shower. It wont hurt the operation of your RCD and aint too expensive to fit in most cases. These days many "tradesmen" fit plastic joints in metal runs without bonding. This could isolate some metalwork and lie in wait for a wet hand in the shower. At the least you must verify bonding back to the supply. If customer doesn,t want the work remember that unsafe conditions can not be noted as departures, you must leave the circuit disconnected.

 

[wozz]

i think manufactures instructions go too far these days, 6inch rigid ducts for cooker hoods! 3amp fuse for fans annoys me sometimes aswell, a kitchen fitter told me they cant get a certian manufacture to honour the warranty of fridges because the engineer always says there isnt enough ventilation.

I read some manufactures instructions today that stated a 'cut out fuse' could be used as a means of local isolation.

 

[steptoe]

7671 is only a recommendation,

manufacturers instructions are deemed legal in order for the product to function as was intended.

that is my view on this subject.

if you follow BRC and customer gets a shock then you will blame manufacturer for faulty product,

but,

manufacturer has already stated you MUST provide SB in order for product to function correctly.

who would win in a court of law?

the fact you werent competent enough to read an installation manual would say a lot about you.

 

[msb2003]

As Steptoe said, BS7671 are non statutory. I believe they say (in simple terms) that as long as main equipotential bonding is carried out and rcd's fitted you do not have to carry out suplimentary bonding. It doesn't say you shouldn't, so no harm in doing it anyway for the sake of a few clips and a bit of 4mm

 

[mayfield]

Instructions normally get read after it doesnt work and a minimum of 4 hours has been wasted trying to get it to work.... then read manual and get it working in 5 mins...

Ah, so it's not just me then?B-)

After all else fails read the instructions