Cirrus
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A client has just asked me to fit a voltage regulator / reducer. I saw these in Denmans last year for about
Voltage regluator & surge protection
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Cirrus
Distinguished Member
A little too big me thinks Canoe - need it for 36 circuits in a domestic environment.
Jono Pashley
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afaik you can get SPD units which are installed on the main tails, cannot remember where i saw them, Schneider do SPD units which might be worth a look at.
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In this months Wired In, there's an article about them, all about a Voltis Home unit (more like a thinly veiled 2 page advert made to look like a magazine article)
As far as I can tell (there were few actual technical details) these units work on the principle that everything these days is designed to work on 230V, but we still have a nominal 240V supply.
So by simply reducing the supply from 240 down to 230, everything consumes less power. Well that's certainly true for heaters, cookers and filament light bulbs, but i'm not so convinced your computer and tv with switch mode power supplies designed to operate on any voltage, would make two jots of power saving on the reduced voltage.
I assume it's a little more sophisticated than an autotransformer, with presumably some form of voltage stabilisation so the output remains at 230v regardless of fluctuations in the input voltage.
It's a little sad that deficiencies in the supply side (like the fact we never did REALLY harmonise our voltage) creates what is almost an artificial market for what must be small energy savings.
There's a claim of "up to 17% energy savings" which for a purely resistive load would be about right. Reducing the voltage from 240 to 230 is a 4.2% reduction in voltage, so that would represent a 17.6% reduction in power of a purely resistive load.
Of course these "savings" are not real are they? For instance, your kettle would consume 17% less power, but it would take longer to boil, so you won't save any KWH usage (you cannae change the laws of physics jim) Likewise an immersion heater will take longer to heat your tank of water. Your shower will be colder, and by the time you have turned up the heat, the flow will be pathetic, so you will rush out and change your 8KW shower for a 9KW model to restore a decent water flow. An electric panel heater will take longer to reach desired temperature before the thermostat turns of etc etc
In fact about the only thing I can think that really will give a true energy saving, is a filament light bulb. That is unless you decide the lighting is too dim, and change it for a larger one. Perhaps it will make light bulbs last longer?
About the only other useful thing I can think they might do is power factor correction. How much of a saving is there to be had in a typical house by PFC alone?
On balance to me, it all sounds like a gimmick. do others agree or not? If these things take off in a big way, will it become the next miss-selling scandal when real savings prove to be tiny? (remember I made that prediction first)
The article did make the point this is largely unknown technology so selling it to consumers would be difficult.
My advice to anyone fitting them, is be there purely to fit something the customer has chosen. If you start recommending them and telling the customer how much they will save, you could end up in the brown and smelly stuff. (just my opinion)
As far as I can tell (there were few actual technical details) these units work on the principle that everything these days is designed to work on 230V, but we still have a nominal 240V supply.
So by simply reducing the supply from 240 down to 230, everything consumes less power. Well that's certainly true for heaters, cookers and filament light bulbs, but i'm not so convinced your computer and tv with switch mode power supplies designed to operate on any voltage, would make two jots of power saving on the reduced voltage.
I assume it's a little more sophisticated than an autotransformer, with presumably some form of voltage stabilisation so the output remains at 230v regardless of fluctuations in the input voltage.
It's a little sad that deficiencies in the supply side (like the fact we never did REALLY harmonise our voltage) creates what is almost an artificial market for what must be small energy savings.
There's a claim of "up to 17% energy savings" which for a purely resistive load would be about right. Reducing the voltage from 240 to 230 is a 4.2% reduction in voltage, so that would represent a 17.6% reduction in power of a purely resistive load.
Of course these "savings" are not real are they? For instance, your kettle would consume 17% less power, but it would take longer to boil, so you won't save any KWH usage (you cannae change the laws of physics jim) Likewise an immersion heater will take longer to heat your tank of water. Your shower will be colder, and by the time you have turned up the heat, the flow will be pathetic, so you will rush out and change your 8KW shower for a 9KW model to restore a decent water flow. An electric panel heater will take longer to reach desired temperature before the thermostat turns of etc etc
In fact about the only thing I can think that really will give a true energy saving, is a filament light bulb. That is unless you decide the lighting is too dim, and change it for a larger one. Perhaps it will make light bulbs last longer?
About the only other useful thing I can think they might do is power factor correction. How much of a saving is there to be had in a typical house by PFC alone?
On balance to me, it all sounds like a gimmick. do others agree or not? If these things take off in a big way, will it become the next miss-selling scandal when real savings prove to be tiny? (remember I made that prediction first)
The article did make the point this is largely unknown technology so selling it to consumers would be difficult.
My advice to anyone fitting them, is be there purely to fit something the customer has chosen. If you start recommending them and telling the customer how much they will save, you could end up in the brown and smelly stuff. (just my opinion)
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Well, I have just wired a huge 'house conversion' [it was a 2 bed bungalow, now it is a 5 bed house!!!] 1 distribution board at each side of house for the 'normal stuff' and 1 dis board adjacent to each of these for the other things like water heaters cooker etc. The idea being that later on I would just fit 2 Variphase units when they had been 'proved'. Anyway I now think it is all smoke and mirrors and I wait to be disproved... :coat
Hi all,
ProDave is of course EXACTLY right...You cannot change the laws of physics....Less in = less out = "turn it up" = back where you started!!!!
Mind you, it shows you what a lot of con artists the government are making us all have "energy saving" light bulbs and the like.
All they have to do if you believe that less voltage will reduce power consumption, is to tell the power suppliers to turn the voltage down to 230, but then, that would equal less income for their corporate "friends" and would highlight deficencies in the distribution network that their corporate "friends" might not like to pay to rectify....
john..
ProDave is of course EXACTLY right...You cannot change the laws of physics....Less in = less out = "turn it up" = back where you started!!!!
Mind you, it shows you what a lot of con artists the government are making us all have "energy saving" light bulbs and the like.
All they have to do if you believe that less voltage will reduce power consumption, is to tell the power suppliers to turn the voltage down to 230, but then, that would equal less income for their corporate "friends" and would highlight deficencies in the distribution network that their corporate "friends" might not like to pay to rectify....
john..
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Is that the same article featuring a Voltis Home unit, that appeared in "Wired In" (as I mentioned above)
Cirrus
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Erm.......Yep what?
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read post #9
Technician
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I read the same article this weekend and the first point
is the payback time. Is there one and how long might
it be?
The second is whether it only works if the supply voltage
is greater than 230V and following on from that, would a
user with a voltage consistently less than this value
realise a benefit? Is the output voltage adjustable?
Prior to any consideration the voltage should be monitored
over a 24 hour period.
But there again, as someone stated, why does it now fall
to the user to correct deficiencies that were once addressed
by what was the old CEGB?
is the payback time. Is there one and how long might
it be?
The second is whether it only works if the supply voltage
is greater than 230V and following on from that, would a
user with a voltage consistently less than this value
realise a benefit? Is the output voltage adjustable?
Prior to any consideration the voltage should be monitored
over a 24 hour period.
But there again, as someone stated, why does it now fall
to the user to correct deficiencies that were once addressed
by what was the old CEGB?
Cirrus
Distinguished Member
Damned cider!
