what do you do

[stringy]

did a rewire last week got to doing the lighting on the stairs, reg number

537.2.1.3

what do you guys normally do?

i put 2 seperate swiches on one for up one for down, had to say it looked cack

ive seen people putting stickers on a 2g switch before now but thats even worse, correct me if im wrong but you cant or you would not put a notice inside the back box would you?

cheers

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

did a rewire last week got to doing the lighting on the stairs, reg number 537.2.1.3

what do you guys normally do?

i put 2 seperate swiches on one for up one for down, had to say it looked cack

ive seen people putting stickers on a 2g switch before now but thats even worse, correct me if im wrong but you cant or you would not put a notice inside the back box would you?

cheers

Norm 2G switch.. one off Up & one off Down lights circuit! (No labels)

IMHO...

537.2.1.3 is relating to more than one SUPPLY... NOT more than one circuit!

i.e. opening sentence..

Where an installation or an item of equipment..

Both of you the lighting circuits come off the "SAME SUPPLY"!

This is geared up toward the situation with Solar PV supplies or similar..

thus cutting the main switch from the incoming supply..

could still leave the PV supply live!

 

[stringy]

yeah i agree with what you say there, but when i took my 17th the tutor was adament it meant the example i said.

it goes back to the old story the regs is how you interperate them

confused now lol

 

[batty]

Norm 2G switch.. one off Up & one off Down lights circuit! (No labels)IMHO...

537.2.1.3 is relating to more than one SUPPLY... NOT more than one circuit!

i.e. opening sentence..

Where an installation or an item of equipment..

Both of you the lighting circuits come off the "SAME SUPPLY"!

This is geared up toward the situation with Solar PV supplies or similar..

thus cutting the main switch from the incoming supply..

could still leave the PV supply live!

Also three phase supplies not usually domestic so a lable would not look out of place.

Batty

 

[montybaber]

remember if sharing neutrals (ie for top landing light) your RCD/s will trip due to the imbalance between phase and neutral

Dont know if its relevant to the thread but im hungover

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

remember if sharing neutrals (ie for top landing light) your RCD/s will trip due to the imbalance between phase and neutral Dont know if its relevant to the thread but im hungover

compliance with 314.4! RED book.

YOU NEVER share neutrals!!!

nowt to do with 17th

314-01-04 YELLOW book!

EVERY circuit shall be electrically seperate from other circuits!

 

[montybaber]

and course its never been done

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

yeah i agree with what you say there, but when i took my 17th the tutor was adament it meant the example i said.it goes back to the old story the regs is how you interperate them

confused now lol

Tutor was wrong! :|

Read the whole context of section 537.2 Isolation & 537.2.1 General

it quite clearly talks about Supplies AND circuits within the different regs.

the following reg then goes on to talk about discharging stored energy e.g.

Additional SUPPLIES..

there is negligible danger from someone opening a light switch with two circuits in it!

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

and course its never been done

agreed there are loads of cowboys who do shoddy work

as opposed to "Good workmanship with proper materials"

any person who connects two or more fuses /MCB's to the same circuit is an incompente fool IMO!

 

[montybaber]

unsure how your post was intended to be read so ill just make it PERFECTLY clear im not condoning sharing neutrals in any situation...I was pointing out that if lighting circuits are wired this way (as many are) then RCD problems will arise when fitting 17th ed cu's.

 

[stringy]

thanks for the help guys

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

unsure how your post was intended to be read so ill just make it PERFECTLY clear im not condoning sharing neutrals in any situation...I was pointing out that if lighting circuits are wired this way (as many are) then RCD problems will arise when fitting 17th ed cu's.

NO RCD problems will not arise.. the RCD will be performing exactly how it should..

I was just pointing out to any others following the thread (maybe not posting) what is good practice and what is bad practice! :|

I assume any competent spark wouldn't go connecting up circuits that do not comply the the regs any more than you would connect a 1.0mm to a 32A MCB?

And you will have tested all your circuits to verify they are separate from each others...

reg 131.8 no alteration temp or permanent undertaken without checking condition of existing installation etc.. etc..

And as you are changing the characteristics of every circuit with a CU change..

ALL circuits will be tested..

And you will do your dead tests before energising I assume?

More realistically combined neutrals should have been identified during any inspections over the past 10+ years??

If persons unknown had done shoddy work in the past..

There is no need to continue it IMO!

; )Guiness Drink

 

[montybaber]

NO RCD problems will not arise.. the RCD will be performing exactly how it should..I was just pointing out to any others following the thread (maybe not posting) what is good practice and what is bad practice! :|

I assume any competent spark wouldn't go connecting up circuits that do not comply the the regs any more than you would connect a 1.0mm to a 32A MCB?

And you will have tested all your circuits to verify they are separate from each others...

reg 131.8 no alteration temp or permanent undertaken without checking condition of existing installation etc.. etc..

And as you are changing the characteristics of every circuit with a CU change..

ALL circuits will be tested..

And you will do your dead tests before energising I assume?

More realistically combined neutrals should have been identified during any inspections over the past 10+ years??

If persons unknown had done shoddy work in the past..

There is no need to continue it IMO!

; )Guiness Drink

did i say continue it? was pointing out a common problem under 17th ed cu changes, to which the only option is to rectify

 

[Apache]

NO RCD problems will not arise.. the RCD will be performing exactly how it should..

Applaud Smiley like it

 

[a1]

No - Never share a Neutral. A big No, no.

 

[sparkyork]

old houses used to be wired with the sw/wire coming from the downstairs lighting circuit, operating the upstairs landing light and returning/using the neutral of the upstairs lighting circuit, therefore causing newly installed dual rcd boards to trip both RCD's.

i had this exact problem just a couple of weeks back, clearly there are ways of determiing whether these problems will arrise but on my particular job i didnt have these problems till after i tested everything. i ended up having to take a new neutral to the landing light to keep the two circuits electrically seperate.

just something to be aware of when fitting new boards in old houses.

rich

 

[Apache]

old houses used to be wired with the sw/wire coming from the downstairs lighting circuit, operating the upstairs landing light and returning/using the neutral of the upstairs lighting circuit, therefore causing newly installed dual rcd boards to trip both RCD's. i had this exact problem just a couple of weeks back, clearly there are ways of determiing whether these problems will arrise but on my particular job i didnt have these problems till after i tested everything. i ended up having to take a new neutral to the landing light to keep the two circuits electrically seperate.

just something to be aware of when fitting new boards in old houses.

rich

Doesn't this 'shared neutral' arise from houses when all lights were on the same fuse and therefore same circuit and not a problem

:|

 

[sparkyork]

unsure of what exactly you mean apache, your above post wouldnt initiate any sort of problem as everything is on one circuit.

you get the problems when you have two circutis and there are links between the 2, usually on the 2 way landing light side of things. when using new dual rcd boards, or rcbos.

 

[Apache]

unsure of what exactly you mean apache, your above post wouldnt initiate any sort of problem as everything is on one circuit.you get the problems when you have two circutis and there are links between the 2, usually on the 2 way landing light side of things. when using new dual rcd boards, or rcbos.

I mean houses perhaps wired upstairs and downstairs together and then circuits split later? I dunno, not a spark. Maybe it's just sloppy workmanship

 

[maccarooni]

Apache Congrats

1000+ posts

Have one on me

MaccaGuiness Drink