Why is an exported earth bad?

[kme]

The only problem with pme is if you loose the neutral but if the shed has a rcd fitted it would detect the imbalance in the live and neutral so would disconnect.I do understand what you are saying step but in my 20 years experience I have never came across a lost neutral on the supply but i have come across loads of high reading (ra) rods and malfunctioning rcds.also if you did loose the neutral on the supply it is staked down to earth in multiple places along its length the only problem would be if you lost it from your installation to the joint in the road or over head.what are the chances of that (slim).as for Code1 I think your are being a bit over the top

I`m somewhere inbetween on this one, guys. However:

Cheggers, m8: on the one hand "It`s ok `cos the rcd is here!", then "I`ve had many malfunctioning rcd`s"!!!

Ergo, it isn`t safe to rely on one, which is why the big book soecifically states NOT relying on an RCD alone.

As Steptoe, I`ve seen a couple of cases of dropped or defective PEN conductors - and they can be REALLY spooky!

BUT:

I would not be coding an exported PME as a code 1 necessarily - although it WOULD be coded.

n.b. Why would you NOT drop the PME connection to the catenary? Where do you find any reg, or guidance, which suggests this as a good practice?

Apache: Calculated risk is acceptable; but if we allow something, which later causes a problem; even if the problem can be laid at the feet of the suppliers, they`ll come for us, `cos we`re easier targets.

Cheggers: You can start a "poll" thread yourself m8, it doesn`t need to be done by admin(s)

 

[Apache]

I agree with everyone here but we do need to be a bit realisticdoes anyone here every came across a lost neutral on the supply

how many people have come across a rcd not tripping

should we be putting in 2 rcds in line just in case of one fails

may be admin could make a poll for this I for one would be interested by the results

We can all start polls! If it interests you that much

 

[batty]

Its is very unlikely that a major fault may happen on a supply. But it could and that is why suppliers do not like you exporting earths to seperate buildings. In the 16th edition it wasn't required that showers needed Rcd protection but manufacturers suggested that it is a good idea to fit them. This is because if a shower or if there was a neutral fault were to happen they would not be liable for someone getting injured. Hence i do not export earths to outbuildings and have always used Rcd's on showers that i have installed.

Batty

 

[steptoe]

Equally I'd never leave the house if I constantly worried what could happen. I might get run over. I might have a heart attack. I might get squashed by a mad cow.It's a calculated risk. It's unlikely but anything is possible. There has to be a reasonable degree of probability of something happening to spend time and money preventing it.

Or else we wouldn't do anything. Life's a risk. None of us are getting out of it alive

I leave the house every day thinking I might not get back(my missus probably hopes!).

its all a risk, but I see my job as minimising that risk, not increasing it to stupid proportions.

I dont jump on railway tracks, so Im not going to export a dodgy electrical connection either.

all about being COMPETENT and understanding the risks,

if you dont realise how dangerous it is then you wont know any different/better,

its one of those scenarios where a little knowledge can be a very dangerous thing indeed.

 

[Apache]

I leave the house every day thinking I might not get back(my missus probably hopes!).its all a risk, but I see my job as minimising that risk, not increasing it to stupid proportions.

I dont jump on railway tracks, so Im not going to export a dodgy electrical connection either.

all about being COMPETENT and understanding the risks,

if you dont realise how dangerous it is then you wont know any different/better,

its one of those scenarios where a little knowledge can be a very dangerous thing indeed.

I don't think any of us truely know all the risks!

You as a clearly experienced spark want to reduce risk to a minimum but I can't see you or anyone else quantifying the risk of the RCD failing the shed been sopping wet and me earth wire melting all under fault conditions!

But I 100% agree it could happen and I now (reasonably) understand why you don't want to export the earth, thanks to yourself and others.

 

[steptoe]

apache, you have nothing to worry about.

once you go in a blue flash and puff of smoke your missus can sue the ASS of the guy that done your cert.

 

[The Godfather]

I leave the house every day thinking I might not get back(my missus probably hopes!).its all a risk, but I see my job as minimising that risk, not increasing it to stupid proportions.

I dont jump on railway tracks, so Im not going to export a dodgy electrical connection either.

all about being COMPETENT and understanding the risks,

if you dont realise how dangerous it is then you wont know any different/better,

its one of those scenarios where a little knowledge can be a very dangerous thing indeed.

The Don & His Boys approve.

The Godfather

 

[Apache]

apache, you have nothing to worry about.once you go in a blue flash and puff of smoke your missus can sue the ASS of the guy that done your cert.

Applaud Smiley

I'll inform her - just incase

 

[steptoe]

apache, the point in all this is,

AFAI can understand,

is you now know or have read the various veiws and the pro's and con's of exporting a PME earth and being an obviously educated man (vets are smarter than doctors by the way, animals cant talk) you can make your own balanced judgement on whether the risk is worthwhile or not.

for me the average punter is not like this and who will use the shed/garage etc is beyond my control and what other alterations may be made after my install is beyond my control so I always have to go on the side of safety.

 

[Apache]

apache, the point in all this is,AFAI can understand,

is you now know or have read the various veiws and the pro's and con's of exporting a PME earth and being an obviously educated man (vets are smarter than doctors by the way, animals cant talk) you can make your own balanced judgement on whether the risk is worthwhile or not.

for me the average punter is not like this and who will use the shed/garage etc is beyond my control and what other alterations may be made after my install is beyond my control so I always have to go on the side of safety.

I understand 100%. Thanks for your patience!

Guiness Drink

 

[Mr Sworld]

I agree with everyone here but we do need to be a bit realistic has anyone here ever came across a lost neutral on the supply

Yes, I have. I moved into my new house and saw a odd earthing arangement, so I took the service head apart and found the neutral was disconnected and capped off!

Called EDF and after a bit of moaning by their engineer that I was mistaken and why am I taking service heads apart they looked themselves and were as shocked as I.

 

[Apache]

Yes, I have. I moved into my new house and saw a odd earthing arangement, so I took the service head apart and found the neutral was disconnected and capped off!Called EDF and after a bit of moaning by their engineer that I was mistaken and why am I taking service heads apart they looked themselves and were as shocked as I.

1500 members there had to be one............

 

[batty]

Yes, I have. I moved into my new house and saw a odd earthing arangement, so I took the service head apart and found the neutral was disconnected and capped off!Called EDF and after a bit of moaning by their engineer that I was mistaken and why am I taking service heads apart they looked themselves and were as shocked as I.

Perhaps it was the contractors who connected the tails the wrong way round at the carpet shop that I worked at.

Batty

Pray

 

[Mr Sworld]

The 'explanation' was that there must of been a neutral fault in the street and they had temporarly used the lead sheath as a 'neutral return'! They had no records of the work being done, mind you, but agreed that it was done by a DNO engineer!

 

[Apache]

To the layman that doesn't sound wise...............

 

[Mr Sworld]

No. Not a good idea at all but goes to show that what you would think are good supplies (not sure if a Zs test would pick that up) still benefit from visual inspection.

 

[Apache]

The thing that makes it more alarming is that if you hadn't been a spark it would still be like that!

 

[extension15]

Why is an exported earth bad?

Like any wiring method, if it's done wrong or a fault occurs,then.........

 

[Apache]

99

 

[Apache]

100

couldn't resist