Yeah. Before the fast tracking there was the black and white of sparky\non-sparky with the smaller(ish) grey area of rubbish\lazy\incompetent sparky. The fast tracking has filled the grey area so it's now recognised as the new white and the white is now black (where white is the proper sparky, black is the non-sparky).
Would you do it all over again?
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Help Support Talk Electrician Forum:
i have debated whether to post this or not.
ive been at pub so forgive me if i cant spell or offend anyone, i do not mean it, and i really dont want to get in to a fast track debate as other forums have.
my experience of this is a bad one, someone i know someone has completed a fast track plumbing course, as a part of this course he got a FREE part P course which he passed no problem, as it was easy. the course he completed was endorsed by a provider which now want him to join them.
when i gently quizzed him about form filling the answers i got were along the lines of 'all them Z s confuse me glad i got through the exam' .
he had no idea you could not install a new circuit on a MWC. and many other examples i could give.
how the hell can this be acceptable?
what is the point in me spending all that time at college?
what is the point in me paying all this money to a provider to come under the banner of Part P when it clearly means NOTHING.
in answer to the original question, myself im doing ok and i am going to work extremely hard to make a sucess of my business. would i do it again? undecided as yet im only 25 and been in business two years so i have time to make up my mind but im edging towards a NO at the moment.
i really do hope this post is taken in the right context.
ive been at pub so forgive me if i cant spell or offend anyone, i do not mean it, and i really dont want to get in to a fast track debate as other forums have.
my experience of this is a bad one, someone i know someone has completed a fast track plumbing course, as a part of this course he got a FREE part P course which he passed no problem, as it was easy. the course he completed was endorsed by a provider which now want him to join them.
when i gently quizzed him about form filling the answers i got were along the lines of 'all them Z s confuse me glad i got through the exam' .
he had no idea you could not install a new circuit on a MWC. and many other examples i could give.
how the hell can this be acceptable?
what is the point in me spending all that time at college?
what is the point in me paying all this money to a provider to come under the banner of Part P when it clearly means NOTHING.
in answer to the original question, myself im doing ok and i am going to work extremely hard to make a sucess of my business. would i do it again? undecided as yet im only 25 and been in business two years so i have time to make up my mind but im edging towards a NO at the moment.
i really do hope this post is taken in the right context.
Cirrus
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Fair post Wozz. It all boils down to one very simple fact - MONEY. I think it is terrible that a scam provider can 'sponsor' a course with a view to signing up people from it.
And please remember that a lot of us who are NIC DI members are 'qualified' the long way round with years of experience in commercial, dom and Industrial. Very few are 5 day wonders although they do obviously exist - defined scope or not.
And please remember that a lot of us who are NIC DI members are 'qualified' the long way round with years of experience in commercial, dom and Industrial. Very few are 5 day wonders although they do obviously exist - defined scope or not.
sellers
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It is annoying that someone can learn 'how to be a sparky' in 5 days. But your not really a sparky, you just know how to pass the exams and whats expected of you.
The long way round is the right way round. I've worked in hazardous areas, schools, hospitals, houses the list is endless and I still have a lot to learn. I'd say it takes 10-15years to become an actual 'sparky' similar to what Deke said in his post.
i wasnt bashing the NIC for once, the body concerned is Corgi, a defined scope scheme. So why are they teaching installation if circuits and installation forms on the course if they are defined scope?
Its madness.
Its madness.
Cirrus
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I wasn't suggesting you were bashing the NIC Wozz, just thought it important to make the point I made.
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Oh how nice it is to be in Scotland without Part P to bother us
i see what you mean lurch and tbh i completely agree, i did a proper apprenticeship where you start at the bottom(the actual bottom where you do nothing but run around after the skilled blokes making tea and sweeping up for a couple months) and work your way up and as someone has already posted i am only know actually feeling like a skilled tradesmen 7 years on from my apprenticeship. personally i feel that passing your AM2 etc isn't the end of anything but more a milestone in your training and learning, much like qualifying in first place doesn't win you race it simply puts you in good stead and sets you up for the real work.
in all honesty i simply cannot see how someone can do a course measured in only weeks or even months yet consider themselves a skilled tradesmen, obviously i know that these courses can work out brilliantly for someone that has been doing the job for years and has much experience but no qualifications because i feel that the real key to doing this and any job well and consistently is experience first and understanding of regulations and requirements a close second.
as already hinted at the people i feel truly sorry for are the customers of poor workmen or people with little or no training/experience as they feel that they will be getting work done by a professional and sadly they can be let down very badly by both those without knowledge/experience as equally as those with little care or consideration despite having all the papers and experience.
for me a good electrician has very little to do with wiring as such but a far better knowledge of the products available, where and when to use what and how to convey this to the customer and get them what the result they really want and/or need. everyone that calls themselves an electrician should be able to put cable in and terminate it.
in all honesty i simply cannot see how someone can do a course measured in only weeks or even months yet consider themselves a skilled tradesmen, obviously i know that these courses can work out brilliantly for someone that has been doing the job for years and has much experience but no qualifications because i feel that the real key to doing this and any job well and consistently is experience first and understanding of regulations and requirements a close second.
as already hinted at the people i feel truly sorry for are the customers of poor workmen or people with little or no training/experience as they feel that they will be getting work done by a professional and sadly they can be let down very badly by both those without knowledge/experience as equally as those with little care or consideration despite having all the papers and experience.
for me a good electrician has very little to do with wiring as such but a far better knowledge of the products available, where and when to use what and how to convey this to the customer and get them what the result they really want and/or need. everyone that calls themselves an electrician should be able to put cable in and terminate it.
I suppose as the OP I should answer my own question!
In the idea that whatever job you do you will hate it (apart from the very very lucky few), I would say I would have gone into gas fitting instead. I'm still thinking all the time I should go out and just do as well as this.
Out of interest, I didn't do a 5 day course nor an apprenticeship. I was taken on as a trainee on CIS, paid for my 2330, 16th and 17th myself, I have not done AM2 or an NVQ. I had been a trainee for 3 years+ though.
What would other people on here class that as?
In the idea that whatever job you do you will hate it (apart from the very very lucky few), I would say I would have gone into gas fitting instead. I'm still thinking all the time I should go out and just do as well as this.
Out of interest, I didn't do a 5 day course nor an apprenticeship. I was taken on as a trainee on CIS, paid for my 2330, 16th and 17th myself, I have not done AM2 or an NVQ. I had been a trainee for 3 years+ though.
What would other people on here class that as?
sellers
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Thats the next best thing to an apprenticeship. Can't go wrong with 2330. There isn't anything wrong with 5day wonders, but it is only a small minority that have the mentallity to do a proper job and take pride in their work, fair play to them.
Now let me get this right , the grey is the new white and the white is now black so is the neutral still blue and what happened to the brown, is it the old red in which case the black should be the old yellow and the grey the blue :coat
Deke
To set up I meant, sorry should have been clearer. What with van,
17th, ,testers, 2391, annual inspections etc. Going to be a little while longer before I recoup it all. Not actually that unhappy just wouldnt come back if I had the time again.
Blue Fox
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I di my apprentiship straight from school for 4 years but on the industrial side done that for 16 years (including the apprentiship). Moved into the domestic side this time last year and am hoping to go full time self employed this year. Would I do it again - no. Too much hassle etc with paperwork and part p etc for electricians, I would probably now be a plumber or tiler or something like that, no part p, if you get it wrong you just get a bit wet not dead, far less responsibility and more/same money. Sparks are the top trade which was why I wanted to do it but am thinking now maybe I should have gone for an easier route. Overall I don't regret anything and enjoy being a spark but think I could have had an easier life.
While we're on the subject of what the 2330 covers, I was informed a couple of weeks ago that once you've done your 2330 level 3, for those who are planning on doing their 17th edition, you only need do the 2382 "update" course & exam.
jibspark
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I wouldnt do anything different BUT im only just keeping my head above water at the moment, agency work pays SOOOO badly!
Im not doing any private work any more, ive decided its just not the way i want to go. After getting made redundant a year and a half ago ive taken a drop in pay of just over 10K!! plus having to pay for holiday days etc! Since then its just not been the same, dont get me wrong i still enjoy my job and im not a bad sparkey either, im just sick and tired of wondering if im gonna get any work when each contract ends.
This year im gonna try to get a permanent job with someone and concentrate on building websites in spare time rather than private domestic work.
Im not doing any private work any more, ive decided its just not the way i want to go. After getting made redundant a year and a half ago ive taken a drop in pay of just over 10K!! plus having to pay for holiday days etc! Since then its just not been the same, dont get me wrong i still enjoy my job and im not a bad sparkey either, im just sick and tired of wondering if im gonna get any work when each contract ends.
This year im gonna try to get a permanent job with someone and concentrate on building websites in spare time rather than private domestic work.
OK - my turn?
I`m in agreeance with most of the postings on this subject of the trade not being the "elite" it once was (Yes, lurch - I know exactly what you meant....)
I did my 236 as a day release from school, in the fourth & fifth years (The old man was an electrical engineer for 40+ years, top man for Bang & Olafsen in the country, in his time), so I was always interested in all things wiring.
Completed 236, went a bit skewiff for a year or two; then had a bad injury that put me off work for several years. Got back into work gradually, first part-time, then full time for 7 years before we started the business:
So I`m at the O/P`s question "Would I do it differently"?
NO! Apart from not being injured! I nearly went into electronics engineering / servicing; but could see the writing on the wall with the Philips G8 & G11 TVs - sooner or later, you wouldn`t be fault-finding a component; you`d be swapping out boards; and a trained guinea-pig could do that.
If I could change one thing - I`d have got started on my own sooner; but cie la vie
KME
I`m in agreeance with most of the postings on this subject of the trade not being the "elite" it once was (Yes, lurch - I know exactly what you meant....)
I did my 236 as a day release from school, in the fourth & fifth years (The old man was an electrical engineer for 40+ years, top man for Bang & Olafsen in the country, in his time), so I was always interested in all things wiring.
Completed 236, went a bit skewiff for a year or two; then had a bad injury that put me off work for several years. Got back into work gradually, first part-time, then full time for 7 years before we started the business:
So I`m at the O/P`s question "Would I do it differently"?
NO! Apart from not being injured! I nearly went into electronics engineering / servicing; but could see the writing on the wall with the Philips G8 & G11 TVs - sooner or later, you wouldn`t be fault-finding a component; you`d be swapping out boards; and a trained guinea-pig could do that.
If I could change one thing - I`d have got started on my own sooner; but cie la vie
KME
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Be nice
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