Can A Report Be Declared "void" In The Event Of Non-Payment?

[kme]

Ok.

Got an absolute bar steward of a client, who had us prepare fire alarm inspections, emergency lighting inspections, and EICRs, to a value of £5000........

Now they`re ignoring my requests for payment

I`m just sending out threatening letters (without prejudice....etc) ; but made the mistake of permitting them to have the actual reports ( bar the BIG EICR, which they`ve got a PDF of ).

Now my T&Cs have a phrase about "removing any installed goods, at the client`s expense" - but the reports don`t have "installed" stuff to remove - its ALL time

Can I declare these certificates "null & void"; until and unless they are paid for?

And will it make any difference?

( n.b. the client is a commercial hotel / pub; em lighting & EICR are VERY unsatisfactory; and the reports were ALL requested by the fire officer. ) I suppose I could let the fire officer see the certs; but if he shuts `em down, they`ll never be able to pay. I had ONE email response, to the tune of "we will pay you when we have the money" - nothing since ( month ago).

Your thoughts?

 

[wozz]

It sounds like they have admitted the debt in a email, this is all you need to get a firm in to deal with it, if you wanted to go down that route, which will obviously cost a  few %.  

 

[ProDave]

Don't mess about.

Send them a letter by recorded delivery stating if payment is not made within 14 days (or whatever terms were stated on your invoice) then you will pass the debt to a debt collection agency.

And  if they don't pay, do just that, and let the debt collection agency do the work, and add their costs to the final bill, taking it to court if necessary.

When I enquired, a local debt collection firm here would have wanted £25 up front to instruct them, and all their further costs would be recovered in court from the debtor.

I guess you are not banking on getting the remedial work then?

 

[Sharpend]

Are they a large outfit? , if so you may want to write to the man at the top. Try here for details of those at the top. http://www.ceoemail.com/

I often have better results coming at a company from this angle at first sign of bull from lower ranks.

 

[kme]

Wozzer - Yes, they have admitted the debt ( and Sharpie, that WAS the "man at the top" :slap )

Dave - Remedial work? They originally wanted me to do everything - but the constant "late paying" was becoming a hassle - and, to be honest, I shouldn`t have let it get so far. They could beg on bended knee for me to do summat - and I`d say "yes, I`ll get there when I can".

" But its urgent"!

"I`ll get there when I can" ( read as " when I feel like it") ( read as "I`m never going to feel like it!")

They`ve just had letters to that effect mate - so we`ll see what happens (THEN I send copies to the fire officer- after we get paid ] )

Reminds me - fire officer wanted Portable appliances tested - THAT hasn`t been done at all! ]

 

[steptoe]

thing is canoe,

They probably dont give a sh** as the report is unsatisfactory anyway, which means they are probably in breach of their insurance requirements also.

 

[Jono Pashley]

Im liking Mr Canoes thinking here.

 

[Sidewinder]

They are now trading without insurance.

End Of.

So, perhaps the local EH dept etc at the LA may be interested, as may HSE...

 

[kme]

Yes, bud. Similarly, I think mr.  MAWWFIRE may be interested - he did originally ask to be kept informed.

BUT - if I do that, and they lose their revenue stream - they won`t be ABLE to pay me.

I`ve got the bullets to fire at them. - just want to make sure they`ve given me my stuff back BEFORE I shoot `em ]

 

[binky]

threaten to shoot and go to small claims court. Failing that offer a payment scheme if they are that stuck for money, but I think that gets too messy.

 

[Sidewinder]

You could issue a winding up order, that normally sharpens the pencil & the mind!

 

[Steve3948]

Someone may already have one or more in on them already, so it could be just throwing more money down the drain.

20 years ago I had a £5k debt, director called me and said don't waste money pursuing this you will not get anything.

I did not believe him and issued winding up order through our solicitors which I found out later was a waste as others already had them in.

They agreed 10p in £ at creditors meeting which never happened, I needed a loan to cover the debt having paid out wages and materials.

Total outlay £10k, took 5 years to recover, could have done a lot with that wasted money, but that's the risk we take, and lessons learned.

Could withholding the EICR be deemed as a health and safety risk, any code 1 or 2, should someone get injured.

 

[Manator]

There is a post here somewhere by me, Do the EIC, EICR and date it for the same as the Invoice payment due date, they pay you re-issue with the correct date, They don't pay the Cert is worthless as out of date, doesn't mean a great deal but better than nothing

I normally don't issue a cert unless they have paid unless i know them, so many a*******s out there today.....

We now do this on all our installs, the EIC is only valid until payment date, once payment is made all the certificates are posted and dated correctly.

Someone may already have one or more in on them already, so it could be just throwing more money down the drain.

20 years ago I had a £5k debt, director called me and said don't waste money pursuing this you will not get anything.

I did not believe him and issued winding up order through our solicitors which I found out later was a waste as others already had them in.

They agreed 10p in £ at creditors meeting which never happened, I needed a loan to cover the debt having paid out wages and materials.

Total outlay £10k, took 5 years to recover, could have done a lot with that wasted money, but that's the risk we take, and lessons learned.

Could withholding the EICR be deemed as a health and safety risk, any code 1 or 2, should someone get injured.

The EICR could be made valid for however long you wanted it to, so date it on invoice date, no payment equals no valid certificate.

 

[apprentice87]

I would not issue a cert at all unless i had been paid.... Ever been to a garage that gave you an mot unless you paid? Once you got the MOT, ever find a post office that would give you the tax disc until you have handed over the cash, thought not!! I know it is not as simple as that, but principle is the same i think!!

john

 

[Manator]

I would not issue a cert at all unless i had been paid.... Ever been to a garage that gave you an mot unless you paid? Once you got the MOT, ever find a post office that would give you the tax disc until you have handed over the cash, thought not!! I know it is not as simple as that, but principle is the same i think!!

john

Unfortunately it is not as simple as that. Every new installation should be tested and the certificates issued to satisfy the requirements. However the length they are valid is entirely up to the person who issues the certificate. I have issued certificates with less than 7 days validation.

 

[steptoe]

I used to sub for a firm and some of my certs were for 24hrs,

never ever did I get pulled on it,

TBH,

I dont think anyone ever looked at them!

they supplied me with an apprentice and he used to think it was hilarious the names we put on them sometimes, !!!!!