Tutorials

[Andy™]

Seems you have also resorted to negative scoobs when I question you Herr Tesla, how childish!

ive noticed that too. shame it doesnt count for anything though....

 

[Sidewinder]

Herr Tesla,

Please learn the correct terminology to explain your opinions.

If you don't know the difference between r1 & R1, then I suggest you find another vocation.

Oh, I have not given you a negative scoob, ever as far as I can recall.

 

[Nicky Tesla]

ive not given you or Andy one either but i am quite entitled to.

I suggest you stop going on about correct terminology when you cannot back your weak opinions up, You just sit there nit- picking instead of answering.

Like i said Ian didnot have a problem so why should you.

mr tesla

other members have complained about the

deleted

part of your post

mr smith also found such allegation and insinuation

to be vulgar and defamatory

mr smith suggests that mr tesla respond in an acceptable tone

or not respond at all

infraction given

no further warnings will be provided

any further posts of a similar tone

will be summarily deleted

and a temporary ban will be imposed

mr smith

 

[Sidewinder]

I teach 2391 to qualified electricians.

I can back up my opinions, however, I am not here and obviously in your opinion not capable of teaching you anything as you are above being taught, even though you cannot utilise the correct engineering terms for your opinions.

When you post a coherent argument suitably described then I will enter into a discussion of the technical details with you.

I don't need to justify or prove myself to you, I have proven my competence in the real world by having passed the necessary academic qualifications, been peer reviewed and awarded professional recognition, and having earned my way in several aspects of electrical engineering both for myself and for several other organisations including global blue chip companies.

Please begin to provide a suitable discussion point and then we can continue discussing the possible issues that may or may not exist.

Until you can explain the issues that you have in the correct manner, then there are no issues to discuss.

 

[Nicky Tesla]

By sidewinder

"Please begin to provide a suitable discussion point and then we can continue discussing the possible issues that may or may not exist."

I did, i asked you what terms it was that you had difficulty in grasping. This is the third time of asking but instead you will waffle on telling us all how high and mighty you are and how the letters for terms i wrote were not quite up to your standard, so you treated them as unrecognisable even though you know exactly what they meant.

I have since been on the IET forum looking at the periodic testing thread and guess what, terms have been written down in a very similar way to how i wrote them. Similar comments have also been made about crazy results such as >299 for IR and amazingly everyone understood.

Amazing that isn't it mister pedantic

 

[Mr Smith]

if this thread

which is intended to be a fore runner

to a useful and helpful guide

cannot be kept on topic

mr smith will close it down

bickering and personal comments

will not be tolerated

mr smith is very unhappy

mr smith

 

[kme]

To try and get the thread back on track...... (Thanks Ian )

I`ll liaise with Snakehips & Manator this week, and see if we can put together a timeframe for something to be provided.

I wasn`t going to comment, but Nicky - you were out of order there!

KME

 

[Voltimax]

I will apologize for my input in the thread going off topic, but I would just like to say my comment about giving Mr Tesla a karate lesson was meant in a context maybe not apparent.

When learning karate you are not merely learning how to beat someone into submission. The most valuable lesson that can be learned is respect, that was the lesson I was offering to teach.

More often than not I find there are too many people on forums that show no respect to other members. Debate is good, poo pooing other peoples ideas is just disrespectful and shameful to boot.

It's hard enough in this economic climate at the moment and we should all be sticking together as a trade and supporting each other where we can. I originally came to forums to both offer and gain advice.

Once again I apologize for going off topic and apologies in particular to Manator since it's his thread.

Oss!

 

[Manator]

No apology required Volti, and very sobering points you have raised.

The tutorial has grown into a monster, one of the reasons it is taking so long is the type of questions Nicky Teslar has raised. Grasping the basic fundementals is vital, and once you get your head around the basics it is easy to progress.

What I am trying to do is not exclude basics, which I often take for granted, as it appears from the questions posed by some people who do testing in the course of their work.

Practical guides are also harder to write because any step missed out could make all the steps thereafter appear pointless or misunderstood.

I have just done a small job where the readings for r1+r2 on a 4mm radial circuit was lower than 0.01, without my additional notes another electrician would never believe this reading, but because a 10mm earth bond to the sockets, lighting, and all service pipes is present, he may believe it.

(Yes 10mm will go into the back of a socket, but its tricky).

 

[Ian Speirs]

I'm sorry if i helped guide this thread away from its course. I was only trying to bring some light heartedness to what was becomming a tense exchange of opinions. I probably dont post anywhere near an much as some other guys on here, as most of the time what i would have said what has already been said, and i dont think there is any point in regurgitating what has been posted.

 

[Nicky Tesla]

I'm sorry if i helped guide this thread away from its course. I was only trying to bring some light heartedness to what was becomming a tense exchange of opinions. I probably dont post anywhere near an much as some other guys on here, as most of the time what i would have said what has already been said, and i dont think there is any point in regurgitating what has been posted.

Dont worry about it, light heartedness is what we need and pedantic criticism is definitely not

 

[Sidewinder]

here is an example of a test done by someonecooker r1r2 0.15 zs 0.20

ring L 0.19 N 0.17 CPC 0.28 r1r2 0.31 Zs 0.27

dr bell r1r2 0.04 Zs 0.09

OK Herr Tesla,

I have no intention of tutoring you for free over the forum, and I am posting this for the benefit of the genuine learners out there whom this post will sadly misguide.

Oh, by the way, I DID NOT report your comment to the mods, that must have been someone else.

I am also NOT criticising you for not using the correct subscripted terms, this AFAIK was not available in earlier versions of the forum software

Cooker circuit, now, normal practice dictates that this is a radial circuit not a ring circuit.

For you to achieve an r1 or r2 reading, you MUST be testing a ring circuit as these would be the end to end resistance values obtained during the ring circuit conductors end to end test.

These are not recorded on a BS7671:2008 form

R1+R2 of the ring circuit would be approximately (r1+r2)/4.

However you know this I hope?

This is why I am being pedantic.

Then you go on to the ring circuit and you fail to use the correct r1 & r2 terms and use L, N & CPC for what I can only assume are your r1, r2 & rn readings?

Again you use

 

[Sidewinder]

Canoe,

I know that how many others would know his middle name, and the relevance it has to the thread is?

 

[Manator]

I must also offer an apology, I did in my last post refer to a radial circuit and denote the tests as r1+r2, this was done just to wind up Sidewinder, who I do respect, and I knew that it would irc him somewhat, having met Sidewinder I also know he has a sense of humour, however it does not help when I post as such. For that I do apologise.

Getting back to a serious note, what Sidewinder is saying is very very important, the differences are huge, the simple change in capitals has a dramatic effect on the outcome and interpretation of test results.

 

[steptoe]

anyone who has attempted the 2391 would know as such,

maybe why one of my pet hates is "MAIN EARTHING CONDUCTOR" , NO such thing,

terminolgy is the difference between getting something to work correctly, and getting someone killed.!

is the switch open, or is it closed?

 

[Nicky Tesla]

Capital O by the way as it is named after a person Georg Ohm, thus as it is a name it is a capital, you know this general rule too then as you are an expert I presume? (Probably incorrectly I would guess, though following your previous answers.) :yawn

If someone asked a question and said to you "main earthing conductor " would you simply correct him but carry on answering the question or simply stand there scratching your head saying "i have been an electrician for many years now and I have no idea what you are talking about"?

If someone asked a question and said to you" ring main" would you simply correct him but carry on answering the question or simply stand there scratching your head saying "i have been an electrician for many years now and I have no idea what you are talking about"?

If someone told you that "for a laugh they meggered one of the lads" would you understand even though he never

said that "for a laugh they insulation tested one of the lads"?

If in the wholesalers an electrician said that "i got an R1R2 on the shower circuit of 2.2Ohms" would you say "sorry ive no idea what your talking about, was that R1 you talked about a capital cos a shower circuit should not be on a ring and i never heard a mention of a + either so im really confused" or do you simply understand and answer by saying shut up you boring git did you see jackass last night or something?

But if someone told me" they had measured the circumference of this blokes head cos it was the size of a bus" , there would be no confusion I would know exactly who they were talking about!

 

[Sidewinder]

Herr Tesla,

Once again, you have nothing constructive to say.

I went against my personal rule not to give direct answers to questions but to guide the questioner to suitable official guidance and gave you direct explanations and still all you can do is offer abusive answers.

Oh and by the way, on the IET forum, which you mentioned earlier, there is not the plethora of learners that are on here who in the early stages of their career would be impressionable.

Once again all you seem to be able to do is abuse those who post, why are you such a Luddite?

Finally you have also not answered the question I posed to you in my last message even though I took the time to explain my situation to you.

You are being such an abusive and disruptive poster who seems to be doing everything that you can to misguide impressionable learners that I am lost for a way to educate you and explain the issues that you may be causing to these people.

We are NOT in a classroom or lecture theatre.

You profess to be an expert, yet you cannot use professional terms in your questions or answers.

I am exasperated at your lack of respect for those entering the trade and striving to better themselves and learn the correct terminology and be professional practitioners.

 

[steptoe]

Capital O by the way as it is named after a person Georg Ohm, thus as it is a name it is a capital, you know this general rule too then as you are an expert I presume? (Probably incorrectly I would guess, though following your previous answers.) :yawn If someone asked a question and said to you "main earthing conductor " would you simply correct him but carry on answering the question or simply stand there scratching your head saying "i have been an electrician for many years now and I have no idea what you are talking about"?

If someone asked a question and said to you" ring main" would you simply correct him but carry on answering the question or simply stand there scratching your head saying "i have been an electrician for many years now and I have no idea what you are talking about"?

If someone told you that "for a laugh they meggered one of the lads" would you understand even though he never

said that "for a laugh they insulation tested one of the lads"?

If in the wholesalers an electrician said that "i got an R1R2 on the shower circuit of 2.2Ohms" would you say "sorry ive no idea what your talking about, was that R1 you talked about a capital cos a shower circuit should not be on a ring and i never heard a mention of a + either so im really confused" or do you simply understand and answer by saying shut up you boring git did you see jackass last night or something?

But if someone told me" they had measured the circumference of this blokes head cos it was the size of a bus" , there would be no confusion I would know exactly who they were talking about!

1

I would ask him WTF he was on about,

pet hate of mine, check any of my previous posts that you want.

2

depends on the age of the spark,

only became a non existent being very recently

3

megger, well for a start I very much doubt that he did, meggers are so outdated no proper spark would even have one in his kit, you sure you dont mean a 5WFW.?

still, believe what you want.

4

a proper electrician would never say that, maybe you hang about with 5WFW too much, birds of a feather and all that,,,,

 

[Nicky Tesla]

1. well you would with your attitude. I don't doubt it

2. "only became a non existent being"...... do you mean like a ghost?......I dont understand you

3.why would a proper electrician not say that....maybe you should get back on your horse?

Plethora****Luddite******* :yawn Big Head strikes again

 

[philbas]

May I suggest this as viewing for the thread

https://www.youtube.com/embed/AWtCittJyr0?feature=oembed