Caravan Site Electrics

[Phoenix]

There used to be a firm near Skegness that made this sort of panel

No idea of their name though

So I am as much use as a skelt

You're thinking of Hawkins, I reckon

 

[Evans Electric]

All I can say is they better get themselves some long mains leads, or their customers are not going to be happy.

And if they think they can just plug two leads in series to make up the length, then they better find somewhere waterproof to put the junction, not just  leave it lying on the ground to fill up with water (which is what WILL happen)

I would have thought the Caravan Club would have something to say on this. If it does not meet THEIR specifications then they can't advertise it as a site with mains hookup.

My thoughts exactly Dave ,    let me see what they say tomorow , if they ever answer the hambone .

Plus as someone said above ..disconnection times going off the scale .

 

[Apache]

Deke - it's all there on the CC site:

"Pitch supply points should be placed so that a socket-outlet is available within 20 metres of the likely position of the caravan inlet during normal occupancy of each pitch"

All being well I have attached the CC document from the website. If putting 6 in make sure you charge between £500-£1000 per point.

technical_advice_on_providing_electric_hook-ups__more_information_.pdf

 

[Evans Electric]

Patche  thanks for that :Salute   , much appreciated, thanks for taking the trouble. .   I see with 6m  gap between vans the furthest one will be well over 20m away from the plugs , but as said above, thats not my concern . 

 

[Apache]

 thats not my concern . 

The problem, as I see it, is you are the 'expert' advising your client. They are paying you good money to do the work (remember up to £1000 a point from that link! ) so there is little point creating an installation for her that is not going to be any use if the CC come around to inspect the site (whether they even do to all the little 5 site places I don't know).

I can see an angry phone call when it turns out the work she paid you to do is not good enough for their requirements.

There are many way (as they say) to skin a cat. Is there a field adjoining the paddock? Could the units be sited on the back side of the fence?

Could you site the hook ups in some sort of lockable cabinet that could only be opened when the horses are out of the field?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/New-Rittal-EB1546-200mm-80mm-IP66-Lockable-Industrial-Control-Enclosure-Cabinet-/221421941875?pt=UK_BOI_Materials_Supplies_Electrical_ET&hash=item338dc6b473

What if you provided maybe 3 commando sockets in the location the lady suggests and create 3 hook up points on a spike that can tread into the ground. Make the hook ups like an extension lead with a plug on. She can trail them out, plug them in for the event. Remove them and store under cover the rest of the year. Would only take a few minutes to set up. Tie wrap cable to fence or something. Would that work?

I don't know, but if you go armed with the knowledge then you are helping the client a lot more than giving her a line of hook ups too far away and then she can't get CC club approval.

 

[ProDave]

There is no issue of "getting CC approval"  ALL you need to run a CC site is space to park the 'vans, drinking water tap(s) and somewhere to empty a chemical toilet.  Anything else is a bonus.

But in order to advertise a facility, like electric hookups, they must meet the CC standards. If not the availability of electric will not be put in your site listing.

I have stayed on many sites before that don't officially offer electricity, but with a nod and a wink you can plug into his extension lead coming out of a distant barn. Whether it's safe or not is another matter.

 

[Andy™]

patch has a point, regs do state distances, so if you knowingly install it without agreeing a deviation then you havent fully complied with the regs

 

[Evans Electric]

All points duly taken on board and noted with thanks.  

  However , I put it to you , M'lud, that I have no control over where unknown people , in the dim and distant future , may or may not turn up with a caravan and park it more than 20m from the sockets I have installed in good faith and to the instructions of the client , who is the designer of the site , and I , a mere player who struts his stuff on the stage of life but for a brief period and is gone , with only his efforts at electrical works  left to show that he once did walk with giants but has now shuffled off this mortal coil .    

 

[steptoe]

^^^^^ to add to that

could you not get him to sign a sort of plan designating where he wants them?

he isnt really designing as such, that would be cable sizing etc as well.

 

[ProDave]

Just write the description of works:

To install caravan outlet sockets at locations specified by the customer.

Arris covered.

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

All points duly taken on board and noted with thanks.  

  However , I put it to you , M'lud, that I have no control over where unknown people , in the dim and distant future , may or may not turn up with a caravan and park it more than 20m from the sockets I have installed in good faith and to the instructions of the client , who is the designer of the site , and I , a mere player who struts his stuff on the stage of life but for a brief period and is gone , with only his efforts at electrical works  left to show that he once did walk with giants but has now shuffled off this mortal coil .    

I would hazard a guess that the client has a greater defense of saying they were acting upon your technical expertise to do the work correctly as they did not feel confident doing the work themselves....

(thats why you are being employed by them!)

And you as a competent electrician "should" have a good working knowledge of all relevant wiring regualtions....

including sections 706 & 721..

So if the pooh did hit the fan you would probably need clearly signed documents in your possession passing all responsibility back to the customer...

Otherwise...

Common sense gives a rough idea of the average size caravan / tent and how much pitch space it needs to safely occupy a shared area with other tents / caravans...

And BS7671 clearly guides that no more than four socket outlets should be grouped together in one location..  

(note on page 224)

and gives distances to pitches and lengths of recognised safe lengths of flex...   (previous post #38)

The client is the non-expert....

You are the person potentially choosing to ignore industry recognised guidance both regs & the CC document Patch listed..

Have you been back to the customer with the guidance of BS7671 & CC to see what they say???

opcorn

 

[Evans Electric]

I'm getting frightened now . I can hear the sirens of the Caravan Police wailing even as we speak.     I was led to believe that  they have spoken with the CC assessor , hence put plugs on said wall  .   If they don't park by the plugs WTF can I do ?    The  limit is 5 vans so I'm putting 5 plugs there .  

   I've said all along that the plugs need to be in the paddock by the vans   but everyone knows better , even my oppo ,  "You're getting too involved , just put them on the wall "     I suggested a small brick built meter cupboard that the horses would't damage but that was poo -poo'd as nonsense .  

Customer does'nt answer landline or mobile  and doesn't respond to messages so I'm now losing interest . I tried for 2 days to clarify this so I've put it aside now .

If they go with the quote for elects in the shop I'll put forward the various points when onsite...    they can get someone else if not happy.

 

[apprentice87]

If they will not answer the phone before you have done the work, then god help you when you want to get paid!! I reckon, they do not want to talk to you because some muppet down the pub says he can do it all for £50 and a big drum of 2.5mm from B+Q

john...

 

[Evans Electric]

Do you need to work or hassle deke ? Tell em to fox-trot oscar if they want to do it their way, thats what i do, won one back only today due to fools !

I certainly don't need hassle Paddler !   A few small jobs  or one like that in a week does me a treat , especially with little or no kneeling so a job like the caravans is fine .  A nice drive into the Warwickshire countryside  away from the big city , job would be  quoted so I'm not required to be throwing it in at 100 MPH  .   Extra bunce helps with council tax & heating bills .  And keeps the brain cells active.  

Client finally called , they were away , anyway chat about the siting of the hook-ups and they're going to get the CC assessor in before making any more decisions.    Still going ahead with shop