Nic Eicr Forms & Idiot

[Andy™]

had a look at a property with a very recent EICR from an NIC 'electrician'.

hes given a C3 to kitchen downlights because they are not fire rated. but looking closer at the schedule of inspections, he has C3 in the box for 'recessed luminares installed to minimise build up of heat by use of 'fire rated' fittings...'

so.. since when did a fire rated light automatically mean no risk of heat?!

and the extent of installation covered by report is great too

'scope of works: upgrade supply earthing arrangements and non-compliant fuse board to amd3 RCD protected unit and furnish new installation cert/ numerous code 2's identified! unable to certify, client has decided to use an alternative electrical contractor for remedial works'

report also has a C2 for a short bit of 1.5 T&E used on ring between socket & fused spur...

and to top off his bad work, DNO told him he cant have TNCS and has to stay TT (like the rest of the area)... so he's stuck a 951 on the sheath... but is OK, he's approved by DNO to do it...

hopefully get some pics next week

 

[Murdoch]

Since when was an EICR used to certify changes? I was under the impression that it was to be used to report on an installation!

 

[Andy™]

thats what i thought too... i was tempted to send a copy of the cert to NIC, but they wouldnt do anything anyway

 

[kerching]

I Pointed out the "use of fire rated fittings to avoid build up,of heat...."to NICEIC months ago

There answer was

 

[Andy™]

There answer was

well tell us, dont keep us in suspense. oh wait, they didnt answer, did they? never really looked at the NIC forms before, but after looking at that one, it is very misleading. almost as mis-leading as a non registered member using their logo. but i know which one nothing will ever happen with

 

[kerching]

Your assumption regarding their timely response is correct

I think they are collating all their responses and sending just the one email......yeah fricking right they are

 

[steptoe]

Kerch,

they dont care about anyone,

I have it on fact that a member of the parlimentary select committee wrote to them on behalf of one of his constituents in his role as an MP and the NICEIC basically told him to piss off , how they police their members had nothing to do with him,,, 

 

[kerching]

i think the main issue is that they do NOT police their Members....only the people who,pretend to be

 

[Steve3948]

had a look at a property with a very recent EICR from an NIC 'electrician'.

hes given a C3 to kitchen downlights because they are not fire rated. but looking closer at the schedule of inspections, he has C3 in the box for 'recessed luminares installed to minimise build up of heat by use of 'fire rated' fittings...'

so.. since when did a fire rated light automatically mean no risk of heat?!

and the extent of installation covered by report is great too

'scope of works: upgrade supply earthing arrangements and non-compliant fuse board to amd3 RCD protected unit and furnish new installation cert/ numerous code 2's identified! unable to certify, client has decided to use an alternative electrical contractor for remedial works'

report also has a C2 for a short bit of 1.5 T&E used on ring between socket & fused spur...

and to top off his bad work, DNO told him he cant have TNCS and has to stay TT (like the rest of the area)... so he's stuck a 951 on the sheath... but is OK, he's approved by DNO to do it...

hopefully get some pics next week

You could just say you looked at an EICR by an Electrician, I don't see what the difference is between any of the scam's they now all have people who are convinced they are Electricians, and since the Domestic Installer farce its got massively worse.

 

[Murdoch]

You could just say you looked at an EICR by an Electrician, I don't see what the difference is between any of the scam's they now all have people who are convinced they are Electricians, and since the Domestic Installer farce its got massively worse.

I think his point is that the NICEIC used to think they upheld standards and quality - yet now they appear to stand for only providing themselves with an income and pension

Sad really

The NICEIC only act against fraudulent use of trade mark and not against traders..... and that is the problem

 

[Steve3948]

Murdoch, no that's what people believe about the NIC, its a myth that gets spread around.

Before this Domestic lark came about the NIC had a scheme that you joined if you wanted to, nobody forced you.

Most who did join, joined because insurance companies, larger companies, architects etc specified that either an ECA or NIC contractor was used, for this reason we joined 29 years ago, and yes I've seen standards slip but its in every area of this trade, it's all about paper filling, health and safety and money, the actual job these days means nothing, now that is sad.

When I started most Electricians wore ties, now they wear hard hats, hi-viz and shorts halfway down the backside, looks professional at least NOT

 

[binky]

standards have dropped / been pushed down across all trades along with the wages.

The NIC do police memebers, but like every institution, they are short staffed and just don;t have the manpower to do the job properly. This generally means they don't get involved in many compliants. They do get involved as expeert witnesses when required.

Policing their logos is easy, hence it gets jumped on as it can be done from a desk.

 

[Andy™]

They do get involved as expeert witnesses when required.

thats if they actually turn up in court when they are supposed to...

 

[steptoe]

thats if they actually turn up in court when they are supposed to...

Which is probably only for logo cases.... 

Certainly not for when their members are doing carp installs 

 

[Andy™]

well it just gets better...

in addition to giving a c2 for the 1.5 on the ring (which as it turns out isnt a ring at all, its a 20a radial mostly in 2.5, with some 1.5), he also replaced a broken outside socket... with a IP rated JB then 1.25 flex to a trailing IP rated socket... which is wired as a spur from the 32a ring for the kitchen... pot, kettle?

and as for the lovely shiney new metal CU, he fitted some 2x2 on the sides & bottom to space it away from wall... then removed all knockouts on the back and left a gaping hole... not exactly fire rated any more

 

[kerching]

Do,the AMD3 boards "have" to be Fire Rated?...or do they just not have to "support combustion"?

Just asking/curious

 

[Sidewinder]

They don't have to be fire rated, just made of non-combustible material, and be installed in accordance with manufacturers instructions.

They don't need to be fire rated, nor fire sealed, nor fitted with intumescent "attachments".

Unless the MI's require this.

They can even be mounted on flammable surfaces it seems!

 

[kerching]

They don't have to be fire rated, just made of non-combustible material, and be installed in accordance with manufacturers instructions.

They don't need to be fire rated, nor fire sealed, nor fitted with intumescent "attachments".

Unless the MI's require this.

They can even be mounted on flammable surfaces it seems!

That was exactly what I thought. I talked to the Schneider rep yesterday as they had a trade day at the wholesalers, and that was what he told me

 

[NozSpark]

I've fitted a few Schnider ones recently,,,, the main problem with them is that the DIN rail is right down the centre

 

[kerching]

I am fitting one of SBS Daves at the moment........but i believe the metal enclosure is NOT the same item that he is going to start selling