Fiat Ulysse Exhaust Manifold bolt snapped in HEAD - Help required please...

[a1]

... Hi all,

Just had a new head fiitted on my car after the gasket going on the other one. All fitted into place and the last exhaust manifold bolt to go in wouldn't do so. Checked why and it turns out that the head was sent down with an exhaust manufold bolt already snapped off in there - Yes I should have checked it, but didn't.

Note that this bolt is snapped in the actual head, and NOT in the Exhaust manifold itself. I know sdace is limited, but is there a way to get it out WITHOUT having to take the head off again?

Sidewinder? Anyone?

Many thanks,

Admin.

 

[Apache]

SW may be your man. It's not to bad to do with the head back off and easy access to the stud but you might struggle otherwise.

 

[a1]

I do NOT want to take that head back off mate.

 

[revjames]

drill stud and remove with eezy out or similar extraction tool - http://www.amazon.co.uk/Draper-Expert-45856-5-Piece-Extractor/dp/B0001K9UEG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1336665319&sr=8-1

 

[a1]

Thanks Rev,

But not good reviews on them.

 

[revjames]

they are a good tool - used by the trade (mechanics) maybe reviews are by incompetent DIYers? you need to be patient with them. Only other option would be to progressivelly drill out starting with a small size until you reach the tapping size - ie 8.5mm for an M10 thread etc. Then tap it out BUT you need to be dead centre with the drilling. Easy outs a good place to start - drench with WD40 for a few hrs before starting. If theres any of the stud sticking out proud and you can get a welder - weld a nut on the exposed part and then get the socket set out!

 

[bazbithell]

I think the biggest problem you will have is access to the stud, as to drill it out your drill has to be perfectly straight to the stud. I really think you'll struggle without taking the manifold off.

 

[m4tty]

I'd go with rev drill it out and remove

 

[bazbithell]

Plus gas is good stuff for seized nuts and studs.

 

[a1]

It is very limited behind. I don't know if I would be able to fit a drill in there tbh. Did consider those 90 degree attachments that go on the drill.

 

[revjames]

Might be something you have already thought.... but will it work with 1 stud missing? I mean have you tried running it with the 1 stud missing

 

[Sidewinder]

DON'T DRILL IT OUT WHATEVER YOU DO!

It is very doubtful you will succeed with an eezy-out due to its location it is probably seized in due to corrosion around the thread.

The eezy-out will not work.

Is the head Cast Iron, or Ali?

How much of the stud is visible, is it flush, recessed, proud?

What size is it, M8? I would guess?

Where is the car?

Have you got power there?

Any chance of a picture?

 

[NozSpark]

Could you get a stud welded on to the existing one and then use a nut to hold the manifold on?

But you said you've just "had a new head fitted", this implys that it's new and someone else fitted it. If that is the case then I'd throw the problem back at them.

Even if you have supplied the parts, the mechanic should check to make sure that it's ok before they fit it!

 

[Technician]

These can be absolute sods as SW has identified.

If this is the exh. manifold, what is the pressure within?

Is it turbo?

What I mean is, could it be ignored?

No, the head should be left and not removed again unless

absolutely necessary and for another important reason.

Depending upon access the stud could be drilled out but

the materials would dictate if this is possible. In alloy

heads the drill could "run out".

If successfully drilled out a helisert could be used, but again,

to do this it looks as if the head should be removed.

 

[NozSpark]

IMHO it shouldn't be too hard to drill out with the head off and using a pillar drill.

Remnants of stud filed flat, centre punched and then drilled with a small drill and increasing to the correct size for a helicoil insert (as we called them)... i've done it years ago with really small screws in avionic alloy castings,,,, you might have to use cobalt drills though:O

 

[Sidewinder]

If I had the head in my workshop I can get the broken stud out with a nut, a spanner, my arc welder and some rods.

I posted a thread recently illustrating exactly this.

I "MAY" be able to do it in the car.

Still waiting for Admin to get back to me!

I have a 1ph air cooled welder, but it does not like 13A fuses very much!!!

I did this once to an XR3i gearbox bolt 3" down inside the housing with the car on stands on my drive from below.

I'm sure I can manage this, unless it is between the bulkhead & the head, if it is on the front then it will be easier.

Will keep you informed.

Oh & Noz, if you get it central when you make the original hole you should not need to "Helicoil" it, (a trade name for wire thread repair inserts, akin to the term hoover), you should be able to clean the old bolt out, and re-tap the thread. I actually carry M3 - M12 & 3/16" to 1/2" BSW "Helicoils" on the van!

I give in though that this is very difficult to get right, and in avionic alloy castings, your method is almost certainly the best.

Oh and if you are using Cobalt drills, then surely it is hard!

 

[NozSpark]

I was just thinking cobalt drills would go through the stud easier?

On one job I used to do I had to fit a worm gear to a stainless (?) motor shaft with a roll pin, had to drill the hole with a 1.1mm and then a 1.5mm cobalt drill IIRC? That was part of the Tornado's "Combined Radar Projected Map Display"

 

[Sidewinder]

Noz,

St Stl is much harder than a manifold stud mate!

A good HSS twist drill would be down the stud easily at the right speed, it is just doubtful that it will be possible to get it accurate enough.

I'll wait to see what Admin comes back with, I may be able to go over tomorrow evening, but I need to know soon enough as I have Dentist at 09:00 then I am up the road 60 miles on a machine breakdown, and there until it is running.

 

[NozSpark]

Deffo mate,

Hopefully you'll be able to sort something for him

 

[revjames]

yeah Noz pay attention! the engine and head are in place - unless its a really big pillar drill with adjustable mounts that fit a Fiat van then it wont be any good....