Sbs Trade Sales

[SBS Dave]

Hi All,

I haven't posted for a while, although I have been selling a lot of both Compact and Standard RCBOs. Stocks are good at the moment, except for 40A Compacts, with only a handful left, as I don't stock many.  I have had a run on this normally slow-moving size, but hopefully, they should last until my new stock order comes in at the end of March.

MY ENCLOSURE MODEL NUMBERS - Just to clarify my enclosures part no. system - For instance, a ENC-14T (T =TDline) has 14 modules, which means 1 x Main Switch + 12 x useable ways. My Model no. always states the number of modules.   Incidentally, the TDline ENC-8T is no longer available.

PLASTIC IP65 RANGE - You probably know I import a range of IP65 enclosures and stocks of some of them are running low. It is not my intention to re-order the boxes, with the possible exception of the ENC-24S double-decker model. If you have any thoughts on this range and my possible decision to phase them out, I would welcome your opinions.

NEW ALL-METAL ENCLOSURES - I am getting near to finalising my specification and my thoughts are as follows:-

• There will be no knockouts in the sidewalls, because they don't look good in a domestic situation and decreases the fireproof capability of the box.
• I assume circuit conductors will either come through a back knockout, or surface wiring will run under the box to a knockout, via a stand-off base. eg a piece of plasterboard, which is as near to fireproof as any other building material.
• An alternative entry point would be a slot cut in the sidewall base, with trunking butted up to the box.
• Meter Tail & Earth could run via a back knockout, or through a surface gland, the hole for which could be cone-drilled or punched out.
• The box finish would be in white, which should be acceptable for all applications.
• Any resulting gaps could be filled in with a suitable fire-resisting filler or a good old water-based plaster.

I already have a sample from China, which I need to modify for the UK market and I will post a photo, when I can produce a prototype mock-up.

As usual, I am open to suggestions and advice on these and any of my products.

SBS Dave

 

[kerching]

Just a thought on the back entry for the tails...

Since these are going to be behind the board and doubtless less than 50 mm from the surface AND very rarely in SWA or Metal conduit/trunking they would need upstream RCD protection which could cause moodiness with the RCBOs in the board. And add a further cost for the required additional RCD. There again, that would be the installers problem anyway

As i said...just a thought

Any news on the retrofit fireproof enclosures?

 

[Steve3948]

Kerch,

The tails are surface, because you will have spaced the board off the wall.

On TT they will need glands though so bottom or top entry, although often side is required.

I think M2 are doing a board that comes with a backplate spacer.

I don't thing the spacer needs to be fire rated it just applies to the fuseboard itself.

 

[NozSpark]

Cough,,, I was in CEF the other day and the Proteus reps were showing off their new CUs... They said that they had a backplate with conduit knockouts on one top/bottom Side and trunking knockouts on the other

 

[kerching]

Another thought....trunking knockouts......if you used plastic trunking would this have to be fire rated or could you just put intumescent mastic in the orifice?

Just wondering

 

[Steve3948]

I think its overthinking on this, from what I understand they just want the fuseboard made from non combustible material, not trying to make everything around it fireproof.

Or have I read all this wrong

 

[NozSpark]

Does the BYB actually say metal or non combustable?

 

[M107]

To cover the tails on a TT system if it's a top/bottom entry installation why not get a copy/bulk order on the wylex gland found on page 9 of their brochure part number EIU add to the cost of your boards & send out as a standard item with every metal clad board purchased.

 

[OnOff]

To cover the tails on a TT system if it's a top/bottom entry installation why not get a copy/bulk order on the wylex gland found on page 9 of their brochure part number EIU add to the cost of your boards & send out as a standard item with every metal clad board purchased.

+1. One of these, needs a 32mm hole:

 

[kerching]

Byb says non combustible...but does not define it

Also says ....or non combustible enclosure...ie a box around it

Also covers garages, outhouses etc!! UNLESS you can prove it is not required via a risk assesment

Still wondering about the REC2 etc as they are AFTER the meter and thus down to the householder even though they are installed by DNO/service provider.......OR does household responsibility start after the REC??

If i could have been bothered I would have asked on friday...but i was not really interested

 

[SBS Dave]

Another thought. ( I don't claim to be an expert on this. I am just working through the BYB, to see how I need to develop my products).

If the tails come through a wall or via a non-metal partition, they are likely to be at >50mm at the enclosure location, so they should not need additional RCD protection.

Tails run on the surface would not need additional RCD protection, until they become concealed, say, underneath the metal enclosure. At this point, they should satisfy 522.6.204(iv), the metal box providing mechanical protection.

Incidentally, 521.5.1, seems to require all LINE, NEUTRAL AND PROTECTIVE CONDUCTORS to be collectively surrounded by ferromagnetic material, which means all conductors through one hole, be it a back knockout or a gland. That would seem to suggest that the Wylex gland, as shown, does not satisfy this requirement.

I have 2 gland arrangements of my own and once I have taken a suitable photo, I shall post it, for your comments.

SBS Dave

 

[Sidewinder]

Another thought. ( I don't claim to be an expert on this. I am just working through the BYB, to see how I need to develop my products).

If the tails come through a wall or via a non-metal partition, they are likely to be at >50mm at the enclosure location, so they should not need additional RCD protection.

Tails run on the surface would not need additional RCD protection, until they become concealed, say, underneath the metal enclosure. At this point, they should satisfy 522.6.204(iv), the metal box providing mechanical protection.

Incidentally, 521.5.1, seems to require all LINE, NEUTRAL AND PROTECTIVE CONDUCTORS to be collectively surrounded by ferromagnetic material, which means all conductors through one hole, be it a back knockout or a gland. That would seem to suggest that the Wylex gland, as shown, does not satisfy this requirement.

I have 2 gland arrangements of my own and once I have taken a suitable photo, I shall post it, for your comments.

SBS Dave

I agree Dave, all 3 collectively surrounded from 521.5.1.

 

[SBS Dave]

A promised, the 2 ideas for Tails + Earth glands.

The larger one needs a 32mm hole and accommodates all 3 conductors. On completion, it would need to be filled with some suitable fire-resistant compound.

The smaller one needs only a 25mm hole and the difference in size is considerable. In this case, the sheathing is cut back and butted up to the gland dome. Filling the gland with some compound, preferably an insulating one, would complete the assembly, preserving the fireproof integrity of the enclosure.

However, I believe running the tails + earth under the enclosure and bringing them into the enclosure via a suitably insulated/mechanically protected knockout is still a viable option. That knockout, along with the knockout for all the circuit cables could then be sealed, either at the stand-off base entry points or at the knockouts or both.

Any input on these ideas would be welcome.

SBS Dave

 

[Apache]

They already make fire resistant glands - why not use one of those?

 

[Sidewinder]

For a TT, I believe that the "industry" "interpretation" is that the outer sheathing of the "tails" must be taken right to the terminals of the up front RCD within the board.

This was what Mark Coles stated at Sandown at the end of last year.

 

[OnOff]

They already make fire resistant glands - why not use one of those?

Indeed they do:

http://www.batt.co.uk/products/view/412/Nylon-Glands-for-fire-resistant-&-Guardian-cable

 

[SBS Dave]

HI GUYS & GALS,

Just to let you know I will be on holiday from Tuesday 07/04/2015 until Thursday 16//04/2015. Because of Easter, the latest date to receive orders is Thursday 02/04/2015, for delivery Wednesday 08/04/2014.

I currently have all sizes of Standard and Compact RCBOs in stock (having learned my lesson in the past!)

SBS Dave

 

[Murdoch]

HI GUYS & GALS,

Just to let you know I will be on holiday from Tuesday 07/04/2015 until Thursday 16//04/2015. Because of Easter, the latest date to receive orders is Thursday 02/04/2015, for delivery Wednesday 08/04/2014.

I currently have all sizes of Standard and Compact RCBOs in stock (having learned my lesson in the past!)

SBS Dave

and precisely why I won't buy your stuff.

 

[NozSpark]

Hope you have a nice break Dave,,, we all need some time off

 

[SBS Dave]

Hi NozSpark , thanks for your consideration.

We have done some good business together and I am sure my holidays haven't inconvenienced you in the past.

To clarify the situation; my wife was 70 last year and as a celebration, we are treating our two daughters, husbands and 4 grand kids to a short Mediterranean Cruise.

Hi Murdoch,

It is nice to know you don't think my stuff is c**p,  it's just my absenteeism that is the precise reason for your decision.

I am sure your regular Suppliers are open Mon-Friday and Sat AM, giving you good access to products during that time.

A fair proportion of my business is done 6.00PM - 10.00PM Mon-Fri, over weekends 9.00AM - 10.00PM, Bank Holidays, etc.

A customer picked up an order from me at about 8.00PM last night (Sunday), for a job today.

You may not like my Business Model, but low overheads keep my prices down and I also offer a FOC DB assembly service to your specification.

Why not try some of my kit, to see whether their advantages outweigh the disadvantages of my occasional holidays?

SBS Dave